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Simpleton

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I've been thinking quite a bit philosophically about how our pass rush should look to contain Hurts similar to what San Francisco did.

Normally when pass rushing you're trying to get upfield, beating an OL to their upfield shoulder or crossing back to the inside to basically shoot a gap to one side or the other. Obviously pass rushers will go through the OL's chests at times with a bull rush or speed to power, but in general you're trying to attack half their body and get around them in either direction, which is even more so the case with how our defense plays with lots of it predicated on speed and attacking upfield.

That can work but I think the 49ers made a conscious effort to do more "mush rush", 2-gap rush type stuff where the first priority was keeping Hurts contained and slowly closing in the walls around him without opening a bunch of escape routes, especially up the middle (B gaps as Bosa said in particular). I think it's a very astute observation and one that probably means we should alter our normal pass rush plan a bit.

I think our pass rushers need to play through the chest of their OL more, try to close in the walls on Hurts and plug up the escape routes up the middle first and foremost. The obvious question with this strategy is what you do with Parsons who is kind of wasted if you're asking him to play a power/bull rush game.

If it were me I'd use him almost as a spy, let guys like Lawrence and Armstrong play the power/close in the walls game on the edges with the DT's more or less doing the same. I'd let Parsons roam and kind of pick his spots to attack when he sees a gap and be the guy who chases Hurts down when he tries to escape the pocket.

The most important thing is the pass rush has to be patient, they can't be out there hunting sacks and recklessly rushing upfield to a spot 7 yards in the backfield just because that's what they'd do against most QB's. Hurts does a great job of making the first guy miss with little shoulder fakes and using the momentum of defenders to let them fly by/shrug off initial contact to buy himself time/space, you don't want situations where he gets past that first guy and there's all sorts of space in front of him because the other 3-4 guys are just flying around recklessly.

They have to be thoughtful with their rush and patient in their pursuit, with the point being that you're kind of just surrounding him and constricting space. You make him make the first move and then go off that, don't make the first aggressive move and allow him to react as space opens up, you want him to be the first to move and then you pursue with speed.

Finally, I'm not saying this is how they should play for 90% of the snaps. There is a time and place to do the things we normally do, but there has to be a conscious effort to play a bit differently than we normally would in certain situations.
 

p1_

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I think a team should do whatever is legal to kill this abomination of a play. This is not rugby.
Just heard that that fucker Mailata is Australian and basically taught his coworkers how to execute this rugby play . Get it outta here, stat.
 

boozeman

28 Years And Counting...
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Just heard that that fucker Mailata is Australian and basically taught his coworkers how to execute this rugby play . Get it outta here, stat.
That could be.
 
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Cowboysrock55

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Just heard that that fucker Mailata is Australian and basically taught his coworkers how to execute this rugby play . Get it outta here, stat.
Any rugby player want to be an assistant Dline coach?
 
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Couchcoach

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I'm keeping this one in perspective. Last week we struggled to beat a 6-5 Seahawks team who had beaten no one except Detroit. And that was early in the season. I'll go ahead and give the Lions credit as a solid team.
Yeah, Philly was humiliated by the Niners' in every way possible. But they also beat some damn good teams along the way, and we haven't. Even unlikely media folks are on the Cowboys wagon. I am as well, with reasonable optimism.
Don't tell me, show me.
 

Simpleton

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I'm keeping this one in perspective. Last week we struggled to beat a 6-5 Seahawks team who had beaten no one except Detroit. And that was early in the season. I'll go ahead and give the Lions credit as a solid team.
Yeah, Philly was humiliated by the Niners' in every way possible. But they also beat some damn good teams along the way, and we haven't. Even unlikely media folks are on the Cowboys wagon. I am as well, with reasonable optimism.
Don't tell me, show me.
I don't think winning or losing this game is a true indicator of what is to come in the playoffs either way.

If we win it'll obviously help our chances at winning the division and potentially HFA, but I'm not going to be peacocking around claiming we're the favorites or anything. If we lose I don't think it means we have no shot at making the NFCC or Super Bowl either.

We're likely to be the 5 seed whether we win or lose, and I think we can beat SF or Philly in the playoffs if we're on our game, just like we can easily lose if we aren't, whether we win or lose this one. Aside from those two I think we'll handle more or less anybody else in the conference unless we implode with penalties/turnovers on any given day.

I think the only thing that would really change my mind is if we either thoroughly dominate or get thoroughly dominated, but a 7ish point game in either direction doesn't change much to me.
 

ravidubey

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I don't think winning or losing this game is a true indicator of what is to come in the playoffs either way.

If we win it'll obviously help our chances at winning the division and potentially HFA, but I'm not going to be peacocking around claiming we're the favorites or anything. If we lose I don't think it means we have no shot at making the NFCC or Super Bowl either.

We're likely to be the 5 seed whether we win or lose, and I think we can beat SF or Philly in the playoffs if we're on our game, just like we can easily lose if we aren't, whether we win or lose this one. Aside from those two I think we'll handle more or less anybody else in the conference unless we implode with penalties/turnovers on any given day.

I think the only thing that would really change my mind is if we either thoroughly dominate or get thoroughly dominated, but a 7ish point game in either direction doesn't change much to me.
Would be great to take the division, though, in case we get lucky at Miami and the Eagles lose another game.

I agree though that the bottom line is to keep improving of course

I don't see a whole lot of how we'll improve much at this point. We are leagues better relative to our first meetings with SF and Philly and to not win this game at home would be disappointing, IMO
 

p1_

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It sucks that winning this game won’t help us much .
 

ravidubey

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It sucks that winning this game won’t help us much .
Mentally I think it absolutely will. For a second, we'd be atop the division, and you never can tell if the Eagles might drop another game. They are a solid team but IMO they should be beatable by most playoff contenders or even the Cardinals if they get scrappy

Also, losing the game could create a glass ceiling for us in a lot of minds, including our own players.
 

Chocolate Lab

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Yeah, you never know what can happen in the last several games. Maybe Hurts dings his knee again and has to miss a couple of games. As average to bad as their defense is, that could easily lose them a couple more games.
 

NoDak

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Would be great to take the division, though, in case we get lucky at Miami and the Eagles lose another game.

I agree though that the bottom line is to keep improving of course

I don't see a whole lot of how we'll improve much at this point. We are leagues better relative to our first meetings with SF and Philly and to not win this game at home would be disappointing, IMO
We have to get lucky to win at Miami?
 

P_T

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This is very true, he loves scrambling up the middle, you gotta keep him hemmed in and if he scrambles make him go out to the edge.
Just like the David Carr tweet, there were all kinds of responses to this claiming "racism"...

like it's somehow racist to make the claim: "If Hurts is contained in the pocket he less effective as a QB.". Even though the stats bear that out. They hear that, a specific statement about a specific individual, and blow it up to: "All black QB's are incapable of reading defenses.". :picard



I'm seriously considering moving to Antarctica and living with the penguins.
 

boozeman

28 Years And Counting...
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I don't think winning or losing this game is a true indicator of what is to come in the playoffs either way.
Well, it will run through SF. If we lose this game, it does not exactly say that they have our number. The way I see it, that game three team trying for the sweep will go at .500.

Specifically for this team, the Eagles are not built for a three-fer unless we are just complete cunts and the fix for the Eagles is in.

I honestly believe in a straight up fight, we will win tomorrow.

But it isn't always a straight up fight.

If we win it'll obviously help our chances at winning the division and potentially HFA, but I'm not going to be peacocking around claiming we're the favorites or anything.
I should fucking hope not.

If we lose I don't think it means we have no shot at making the NFCC or Super Bowl either.

Not the way things are looking...."potentially".

The real issue always is the state of mind of the team.

They have a good vibe going it seems.

It appears they are good with the battle being longer than it should, but it is their own damn fault.
 
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