2021 Cowboys Draft Chatter Thread...

[Genghis Khan]

It's not good value but I'd still do it.

You're still getting a comparable player at 17 compared to what would have been there at 10. And you get an additional good prospect that you otherwise wouldn't have.

Obviously I'd like better compensation but if I can't get it I'd still do this.

2 good players over 1 good player.

The difference between say Surtain or Farley and maybe Parsons or Horn isn't enough to make me want to miss out on a good 3rd prospect.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

It's not good value but I'd still do it.

You're still getting a comparable player at 17 compared to what would have been there at 10. And you get an additional good prospect that you otherwise wouldn't have.

Obviously I'd like better compensation but if I can't get it I'd still do this.

2 good players over 1 good player.

The difference between say Surtain or Farley and maybe Parsons or Horn isn't enough to make me want to miss out on a good 3rd prospect.

I get it but at say 10 you can pick between Surtain, Farley, Parsons or Horn and get the guy you really want out of the group, At 17 you may only have the choice of Surtain for example. So is it worth it? I guess if you really don't care between all of those guys you trade down at all costs. But to me I'd rather take the guy I really want at the position I really want as opposed to a middle third round pick and being forced into one particular guy. Just kind of my gut on it. I wouldn't be desperate to move down I guess is what I'm saying. Not enough to sort of be trade raped.

 

[ravidubey]

I get it but at say 10 you can pick between Surtain, Farley, Parsons or Horn and get the guy you really want out of the group, At 17 you may only have the choice of Surtain for example. So is it worth it? I guess if you really don't care between all of those guys you trade down at all costs.

Who cares, when the dropoff from Surtain to Wade or Samuel is not huge, while the dropoff in value from 10 to 17 is ginormous by comparison?

Also, fixating on the CB position at all seems silly.

The "thinking" that takes us down this rabbit hole is the exact opposite of how the draft is supposed to work.

1. Defense at times in 2020 was all-time terrible, so we must draft a defensive player with the top pick in 2021
2. The best defensive value at 10 in 2021 is a CB :(, so we must draft a CB first!!
3. Can do we trade down and still get our CB?? GethurdunJerahhh!!

Just a bizarro chain of logic.

How about get the most talented player (or most valuable trade) you can find at pick 10? No! That means we won't win the Superbowl in 2021 because we didn't fix the defense with the first pick. News flash, we won't fix the defense with the first pick, and we ain't winning the fucking Superbowl in 2021 no matter whom we pick. Sorry, eternal optimists, there is no one year fix.

Get the best player, and there's hope for future years.

 

[bbgun]

News flash, we won't fix the defense with the first pick, and we ain't winning the fucking Superbowl in 2021 no matter whom we pick. Sorry, eternal optimists, there is no one year fix.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Who cares, when the dropoff from Surtain to Wade or Samuel is not huge, while the dropoff in value from 10 to 17 is ginormous by comparison?

Also, fixating on the CB position at all seems silly.

The "thinking" that takes us down this rabbit hole is the exact opposite of how the draft is supposed to work.

1. Defense at times in 2020 was all-time terrible, so we must draft a defensive player with the top pick in 2021
2. The best defensive value at 10 in 2021 is a CB :(, so we must draft a CB first!!
3. Can do we trade down and still get our CB?? GethurdunJerahhh!!

Just a bizarro chain of logic.

How about get the most talented player (or most valuable trade) you can find at pick 10? No! That means we won't win the Superbowl in 2021 because we didn't fix the defense with the first pick. News flash, we won't fix the defense with the first pick, and we ain't winning the fucking Superbowl in 2021 no matter whom we pick. Sorry, eternal optimists, there is no one year fix.

Get the best player, and there's hope for future years.

Huh? Who said we have to draft a corner at all costs?

And beyond that who the hell thinks Surtain to Wade or Samuel isn't a huge drop off? I certainly think that's a massive dropoff. Hell I wouldn't touch Wade in the first if my life depended on it. Samuel is a second rounder. But we weren't just talking about corners.

 

[NoDak]

Who cares, when the dropoff from Surtain to Wade or Samuel is not huge, while the dropoff in value from 10 to 17 is ginormous by comparison?

Also, fixating on the CB position at all seems silly.

The "thinking" that takes us down this rabbit hole is the exact opposite of how the draft is supposed to work.

1. Defense at times in 2020 was all-time terrible, so we must draft a defensive player with the top pick in 2021
2. The best defensive value at 10 in 2021 is a CB :(, so we must draft a CB first!!
3. Can do we trade down and still get our CB?? GethurdunJerahhh!!

Just a bizarro chain of logic.

How about get the most talented player (or most valuable trade) you can find at pick 10? No! That means we won't win the Superbowl in 2021 because we didn't fix the defense with the first pick. News flash, we won't fix the defense with the first pick, and we ain't winning the fucking Superbowl in 2021 no matter whom we pick. Sorry, eternal optimists, there is no one year fix.

Get the best player, and there's hope for future years.

That's some nice drama there, but I don't recall anybody here saying we MUST DRAFT DEFENSE with our first pick, regardless of who is there. CB or not. And certainly not claiming we need to do it to win the super bowl in 2021. Only that drafting a player where we are already sitting pretty good is a foolish way to spend a high draft pick, when our team is littered with holes. Hell, I've seen a lot of people here advocating drafting an offensive tackle. Rashawn Slater has been a pretty popular name. And remember when we were in position to possibly having the 3rd pick? Most people here were salivating at the possibility of drafting Penei Sewell.

 

[ravidubey]

Huh? Who said we have to draft a corner at all costs?

And beyond that who the hell thinks Surtain to Wade or Samuel isn't a huge drop off? I certainly think that's a massive dropoff. Hell I wouldn't touch Wade in the first if my life depended on it. Samuel is a second rounder. But we weren't just talking about corners.

Good to know we are not fixated on a position, because when Horn, Surtain, and Farley are three of the choices, it bugs me.

And the dropoff between Surtain and Wade/Samuel is not that far. It isn't. I understand some are considered 1st rounders and others 2nd rounders-- this is exactly my point. They are all good players and not far from each other in ability, so those that are 1st rounders really aren't that great and none of them are really worth a top ten pick IMO.

 

[shoop]

Agreed. I am really hoping there is a trade down option. I would be perfectly happy moving down into the late teens early 20s and taking the best of the available safeties.

 

[p1_]

Agreed. I am really hoping there is a trade down option. I would be perfectly happy moving down into the late teens early 20s and taking the best of the available safeties.

what would you need in addition to that late teens/early twenties to move down?

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Good to know we are not fixated on a position, because when Horn, Surtain, and Farley are three of the choices, it bugs me.

And the dropoff between Surtain and Wade/Samuel is not that far. It isn't. I understand some are considered 1st rounders and others 2nd rounders-- this is exactly my point. They are all good players and not far from each other in ability, so those that are 1st rounders really aren't that great and none of them are really worth a top ten pick IMO.

Wade is total trash. Please explain to me why he isn't?

 

[ravidubey]

Wade is total trash. Please explain to me why he isn't?

One would have a much harder time explaining why Surtain is a top 10 pick-- other than Dallas needs a CB and has the 10th pick.

Even if you hate Wade (which, apparently you do :) ), there are other corners who are consensus 2nd rounders like Samuel who are fine. Why is Surtain worth taking 32 picks earlier than Samuel?

It just doesn't make sense because he is not that much better or impactful.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

One would have a much harder time explaining why Surtain is a top 10 pick-- other than Dallas needs a CB and has the 10th pick.

Even if you hate Wade (which, apparently you do :) ), there are other corners who are consensus 2nd rounders like Samuel who are fine. Why is Surtain worth taking 32 picks earlier than Samuel?

It just doesn't make sense because he is not that much better or impactful.

Well in all fairness I'm more of a Farley fan myself. And yes he is heads and tails better than the other guys in my opinion. Better instincts, better size, speed and play making ability.

 

[ravidubey]

Well in all fairness I'm more of a Farley fan myself. And yes he is heads and tails better than the other guys in my opinion.

I kind of agree on Farley

Still not a fan of taking him 10th

 

[Couchcoach]

I think we can agree on the two main reasons we sucked last year:
1. Dak's absence
2. Defense (nuff said). But I do think Nolan's system was the main reason for the debacle. Not near as much a lack of talent.
But even if Dak is signed, this team just isn't a contender. Period. We've slowly, and subtly eroded at nearly every position, except WR.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

I think we can agree on the two main reasons we sucked last year:
1. Dak's absence
2. Defense (nuff said). But I do think Nolan's system was the main reason for the debacle. Not near as much a lack of talent.
But even if Dak is signed, this team just isn't a contender. Period. We've slowly, and subtly eroded at nearly every position, except WR.

I think a lot hinges on the defense and the O-lines health. If our O-line stays mostly healthy we will have a top offense that's going to be hard for anyone to stop. But even with a great offense we at least need a reliable defense to compete. And while the scheme was a problem last year so were the players. We need to improve the talent.

 

[shoop]

what would you need in addition to that late teens/early twenties to move down?

The draft chart gives a value difference of 450 points from 10 to #20. Chicago has the 20th pick and would possibly work as a trade partner especially since they have all of their draft picks this year. 52 is worth 380 and 83 is worth 115. Assuming the trade value for the bears next year pick is 425 ( half of this years pick) I personally would like to see this year's first and next year's or this year's first, second, and third or possibly fourth with a late round pick going back. If I traded ones this year plus a second and change I would not be too upset.

 

[ravidubey]

I think we can agree on the two main reasons we sucked last year:
1. Dak's absence
2. Defense (nuff said). But I do think Nolan's system was the main reason for the debacle. Not near as much a lack of talent.
But even if Dak is signed, this team just isn't a contender. Period. We've slowly, and subtly eroded at nearly every position, except WR.

I think you can reverse those two, but those are the biggest reasons.

When Dak was here he was a spinny onsides kick away from being 0-4 as a starter

 

[Couchcoach]

I think you can reverse those two, but those are the biggest reasons.

When Dak was here he was a spinny onsides kick away from being 0-4 as a starter

Yep! And fans tend to forget (or dismiss) that

 

[Genghis Khan]

That's a retarded way to look at it when you consider Dak put up 31.5 points per game while being a "spinny onsides kick away from being 0-4 as a starter", and the defense gave up a ridiculous, nearly unprecedented 36.5 points per game.

Pretty much every QB on earth would have been a "spinny onsides kick away from being 0-4 as a starter" with that defense.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

That's a retarded way to look at it when you consider Dak put up 31.5 points per game while being a "spinny onsides kick away from being 0-4 as a starter", and the defense gave up a ridiculous, nearly unprecedented 36.5 points per game.

Pretty much every QB on earth would have been a "spinny onsides kick away from being 0-4 as a starter" with that defense.

Yeah the argument could easily be made if our defense was even decent we would have been 4-0. So who gives a shit. You don't see much of people claiming Watson sucks because he didn't win much last year.