Buccaneers Stuff...

Cotton said:
True, but Pickens took it from great to elite, and I don't want to lose that. Like Ace said, unless he falls apart mentally, you have to find a way to sign him.
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The elite offense was one catch from being beat by Houston and if Daniels hadn't got hurt we could be sitting here with 0 wins.

I dont necessarily say that we should but I can see the reasoning behind doing it.
 
Rev said:
The elite offense was one catch from being beat by Houston and if Daniels hadn't got hurt we could be sitting here with 0 wins.

I dont necessarily say that we should but I can see the reasoning behind doing it.
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I mean, we can play what-ifs all day. What if Durant, Thompson, Revel, Tyler Smith, Hooker, and Overshown hadn't all gotten hurt? Our offense is elite with Pickens. It is great without him. I would rather our offense be elite.
 
I don’t agree with this notion that we don’t need Pickens. We traded for him for a reason, there was a gaping black hole at #2 WR that guys like Brandin Cooks, Jonathan Mingo and Ryan Flournoy are incapable of filling.

We need Pickens. If he’s traded or allowed to leave, we need to spend assets to replace him immediately. That’s a first round drafted rookie, or at least a second round, albeit with much less certainty that pick works out then, or an impact free agent, or go find another veteran you can trade for. But if they think they’re just gonna pull Stefan Diggs off the free agent pile at the end of the offseason, they’ve shown they have no luck with that. They’ll have to go trade for a guy LIKE PICKENS again. Like when they went out and traded for Amari Cooper. They need the second high end WR.
 
Smitty said:
I don’t agree with this notion that we don’t need Pickens. We traded for him for a reason, there was a gaping black hole at #2 WR that guys like Brandin Cooks, Jonathan Mingo and Ryan Flournoy are incapable of filling.

We need Pickens. If he’s traded or allowed to leave, we need to spend assets to replace him immediately. That’s a first round drafted rookie, or at least a second round, albeit with much less certainty that pick works out then, or an impact free agent, or go find another veteran you can trade for. But if they think they’re just gonna pull Stefan Diggs off the free agent pile at the end of the offseason, they’ve shown they have no luck with that. They’ll have to go trade for a guy LIKE PICKENS again. Like when they went out and traded for Amari Cooper. They need the second high end WR.
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I wouldn't trade him, personally. I think we can keep him and still have enough resources to build the defense into something that's good enough to win a Super Bowl with an elite offense, especially now that Guyton is a reliable starting LT.
 
Smitty said:
I don’t agree with this notion that we don’t need Pickens. We traded for him for a reason, there was a gaping black hole at #2 WR that guys like Brandin Cooks, Jonathan Mingo and Ryan Flournoy are incapable of filling.

We need Pickens. If he’s traded or allowed to leave, we need to spend assets to replace him immediately. That’s a first round drafted rookie, or at least a second round, albeit with much less certainty that pick works out then, or an impact free agent, or go find another veteran you can trade for. But if they think they’re just gonna pull Stefan Diggs off the free agent pile at the end of the offseason, they’ve shown they have no luck with that. They’ll have to go trade for a guy LIKE PICKENS again. Like when they went out and traded for Amari Cooper. They need the second high end WR.
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Yeah you're just robbing Peter to pay Paul. If at the end of the day you're not paying Pickens because you need that money to "improve" the defense it first requires you to use the money to improve the defense. I'm not talking about using the money to resugn Porter or someone else already on the roster. I'm talking about using the money to go get a 30 mil a year impact player in free agency, which this team has never done.

Whatever draft pick you get back is nice but the draft pick is basically burned up just hoping to get a player as good as Pickens. Even with a first round pick that's no guarantee. So it all feels like a short term net negative.
 
Rev said:
The elite offense was one catch from being beat by Houston and if Daniels hadn't got hurt we could be sitting here with 0 wins.

I dont necessarily say that we should but I can see the reasoning behind doing it.
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Yeah, but it's way too early to know how much better this defense is or isn't which is why I think it's way too premature to start talking about getting rid of Pickens in favor of defensive help.

One, we haven't had our best 11 on the field together yet and still won't till roughly 4 games from now.

Second, we have a bunch of new players on that side of the ball trying to learn this system as they go. And three of those players that we're really counting on are rookies (Barham, Downs, Lawrence) -- so on top of the fact that they are trying to learn the system, they're simultaneously having to adapt to the NFL level of play.

And lastly, Christian Parker.

Is he good? Is he bad? Like the defense as a whole, it's too early to say because he is also trying to learn as he goes.

So when you take all of this into consideration, I think it's way too early to make any sort of definitive conclusions about the defense.

I think we have a good amount of legitimate talent on that side of the ball so it stands to reason it will get better. By how much remains to be seen, but my point is, it's way too early to either discard them or crown them and we'll have a much better idea of how and what they are a month or so from now....and that's when we can start having a more informed discussion about what areas we need to address and which ones we need to sacrifice.
 
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