2023 Random Cowboys Stuff Thread

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bbgun said:
Shame about Billy Sims. He was on a HOF trajectory. Ditto Sterling Sharpe. Both are probably more deserving than some borderline guys who have gotten in.
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Hell, Billy’s number isn’t even his. Sterling was surpassed by his own brother
 
Texas Ace said:
Sterling would have been the better player in the end had he not suffered the injury.

As great as Shannon was, Sterling was a monster.
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I agree completely

Favre to Sharpe was a sick combination, as was Majkowski to Sharpe.

One of the most talented WRs I’ve ever seen
 
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A hotel lobby is hardly private. Would be reckless if he tried something there.
 
ravidubey said:
Prolly true for most RBs we call elite, though. There would be 4-5 years you would call great. What you do in that time is important.
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Kinda disagree, kinda agree.

To stitch two comments together, I disagree that ‘85% production’ is ‘prolly true for most RBs we call elite’. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’d say it’s false for any all-time rushing list Top 20 RB. Maybe it’s true only for Priest Holmes, Jamaal Charles and Demarco Murray, but they’re not ‘RBs we call elite’ (few exceptions of elite are Earl Campbell, Gale Sayers).

I do agree that an elite RBs legacy is largely based on the best 4-5 years. However, it seems that Hall of Fame induction significantly weighs having an additional 3-4 good/great seasons. Terrell Davis isnt controversial because his four seasons weren’t elite, it was that he didn’t have the extra 3-4 good/great seasons to supplement. While Emmitt’s 91-95 seasons are his prime, it’s his six good/great seasons over 1,000 yards after 1996 that make him a no-brainer Hall of Famer.
 
data said:
Kinda disagree, kinda agree.

To stitch two comments together, I disagree that ‘85% production’ is ‘prolly true for most RBs we call elite’. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’d say it’s false for any all-time rushing list Top 20 RB. Maybe it’s true only for Priest Holmes, Jamaal Charles and Demarco Murray, but they’re not ‘RBs we call elite’ (few exceptions of elite are Earl Campbell, Gale Sayers).

I do agree that an elite RBs legacy is largely based on the best 4-5 years. However, it seems that Hall of Fame induction significantly weighs having an additional 3-4 good/great seasons. Terrell Davis isnt controversial because his four seasons weren’t elite, it was that he didn’t have the extra 3-4 good/great seasons to supplement. While Emmitt’s 91-95 seasons are his prime, it’s his six good/great seasons over 1,000 yards after 1996 that make him a no-brainer Hall of Famer.
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I'm not disagreeing, but we remember Emmitt for 91-95, including both League and Superbowl MVP awards and three Lombardi trophies. Back to back Jim Thorpe trophies in 92-93 put him in very rare company with Peyton Manning, Earl Campbell and Brett Favre since that award has been retired.

The rest was gravy on that steak, with a bit more steak in the form of the all-time rushing title.

I mostly think the "putting in your time" requirement is half bullshit.

IMO the right Terrell Davis comparison is Shaun Alexander, a league MVP with 5 great years sandwiched in a 9 year career but never a Superbowl champ. Alexander had plenty of longevity and awesome production at the time setting the rushing TD record.

Davis' recognition shows just how valuable Superbowl trophies are and what a great back's contribution to one (let alone two) can mean.

Ladainian Tomlinson is the comparison on the other end of the spectrum for Alexander. LT had 8 elite years, League MVP, all time TD record (took it from Alexander). No Superbowl, but enough production to justify the HOF over Alexander.

Frank Gore probably backs in with some kind of longevity award. LT time in role but not quite the same level of dominance and Beyonce stole his Superbowl glory by knocking out the power.
 
ravidubey said:
I mostly think the "putting in your time" requirement is half bullshit.
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Im with you in that I don’t care as much as most people when looking at all-time career stats, which is why I look down upon Bettis and Gore.

But I still think Terrell Davis was too short of a career. Patrick Willis is getting penalized right now and he put up seven full seasons with no past-his-prime bullshit stat-padding years.

Priest Holmes has three of the top 50 seasons all-time for scrimmage yards and gets no HOF love. I’m fine with that.
 
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p1_ said:
please clarify 'elite' season for a RB.
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I use the term loosely for this argument; It’s not a binary number and elite can change depending on the conversation. For this discussion, just took a quick stab at ~1,400 yards/16 games for these two pure runners (Bettis and Gore)

Bettis’ 2000 season was almost 1,400yards, but 3.8YPC which is way below the Mendoza line, so I didn’t count this as a fourth elite season.
 
Texas Ace said:
But outside of that? The guy is absolutely finished and I would hate to see him come back to Dallas because I know these morons will think he is still an asset and won't address the RB position as they should in the offseason.
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I think Zeke still has some value in a limited capacity. I just don't trust the Cowboys to use him wisely. Which is why I hope he's played his last down as a Dallas Cowboy.

If he returned to Dallas these clowns would probably still insist on giving him 12-15 carries per game. Also, if Pollard is going to be RB1 next season, it's already been established that he's not a 20 carry per game RB. So the Cowboys are going to need another dependable RB who can give them at least 10 carries per game. I'd rather not waste those carries on a 3 ypc RB like Zeke.

As for Zeke's value, I think he could stretch out his career in a backup role for a team like the Jets or Broncos....getting only ~5 carries per game, primarily in short yardage.
 
Chocolate Lab said:
I don't think Gore should be in either.

He'll probably make it, though. I didn't realize he had an all-decade team... how did that happen?
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And I bet no one can recall a single Frank Gore highlight or signature moment.

If you're best known for tearing up your knees in college, you probably shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame.
 
data said:
I use the term loosely for this argument; It’s not a binary number and elite can change depending on the conversation. For this discussion, just took a quick stab at ~1,400 yards/16 games for these two pure runners (Bettis and Gore)

Bettis’ 2000 season was almost 1,400yards, but 3.8YPC which is way below the Mendoza line, so I didn’t count this as a fourth elite season.
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IIRC, the Steelers were still running a very archaic offense during those Bettis years. They still had a '3 yards and a cloud of dust' mentality well into the early 2000s.
 
1bigfan13 said:
IIRC, the Steelers were still running a very archaic offense during those Bettis years. They still had a '3 yards and a cloud of dust' mentality well into the early 2000s.
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Well when you never get penalized for anything that strategy can work. You never have to worry about a hold or any play setting you back.
 
1bigfan13 said:
. I'd rather not waste those carries on a 3 ypc RB like Zeke.
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Even worse than that is when we go into an obvious passing down and then split Zeke out wide. Like no one is worried about that slow ass catching a pass. I legitimately wonder if defenses just laugh when Dallas does that. When he does catch a ball he is immediately down. It's almost crazy to me how little he is able to break a tackle or make someone miss. Just give me someone with some fresh legs. Give me Zach Evans out of Ole Miss. Another RB who we haven't talked about much but he was super productive, has a perfect build and can carry the rock. People make RB sound way more complicated than it is. You block right and get a guy back there with some legs to take advantage of it.
 
data said:
Im with you in that I don’t care as much as most people when looking at all-time career stats, which is why I look down upon Bettis and Gore.

But I still think Terrell Davis was too short of a career. Patrick Willis is getting penalized right now and he put up seven full seasons with no past-his-prime bullshit stat-padding years.

Priest Holmes has three of the top 50 seasons all-time for scrimmage yards and gets no HOF love. I’m fine with that.
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Just got to look at the quality.

League MVP carries a ton of weight, combined with Superbowl MVP and Lombardi and that is almost a wrap.

Sure if it was just one season, but in Davis's situation it was multiple (four) and two Superbowls where he was the driving force.

Willis never got a trophy nor did Holmes. It's the biggest and most important achievement, IMO. A team achievement for sure, but when you win and are among the biggest reasons why, I'm OK with it.
 
Cowboysrock55 said:
People make RB sound way more complicated than it is. You block right and get a guy back there with some legs to take advantage of it.
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Yep. Malik Davis and Pollard did fine in that Tennessee game.
 
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