To Tank Or Not To Tank

Texas Ace

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I read through the gameday thread and it seems like we have mixed opinions on how we all want the season to finish.

Unlike past seasons, I can definitely see arguments for both whereas under Garrett I was all about losing out once I determined that the team wasn't good.

Personally, I'm glad they won today. I want them to win as much as possible.

If they lose every game and end up with a great draft pick, that's cool too. But this isn't like the Garrett years for me where once I knew they weren't going anywhere I just wanted them to tank for draft position or in hopes that we would eventually fire Garrett.

Unlike those years, this team stands more to lose by tanking and they also stand a lot more to gain by building momentum going into the next season.

McCarthy is coming back next year no matter what, so the last thing we need is for any of these players that will be returning next year to have any doubt in him or his staff. We need these players to believe in this staff and the direction they are going in heading into the 2021 season. That's why it's important to me that they take as many positives from this season as possible into the off-season.

The last few weeks have shown me that things are starting to click. The coaches are now becoming more familiar with what these players are best at, and the players are starting to understand better what it is the coaches are asking of them.

If there's such a thing as gracefully tanking, then I would love to see it. You finish 5-11 but you're competitive in every game. But if it turns into a 7 or 8 win season where they finish strong and win this shitty division, even if we all know that aren't going to do anything in the playoffs, I would be just fine with that outcome too because I think there's a lot of good that can come from it.
 

Simpleton

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Do I want the coaches to basically throw games by playing DiNucci?

No, that not only stunts the development of other players but it also is a quick way to lose the team, and regardless of that they aren't going to do it anyway because somehow these guys might actually be the favorites to win the division at this point.

I also think it's important for next year for the team to show improvement and dare I say it, fight. That's why the Pittsburgh loss was so awesome, they basically outplayed the only undefeated team in the league but due to a set of unfortunate circumstances and nonsensical flags they managed to lose.

Now, with all that said, my stance on "tanking" (basically rooting for draft position because we aren't tanking) changed a good bit once I saw Burrow carted off. They aren't going to win another game with Ryan Finley at QB and they are a 100% lock to take Sewell in the first. The Jaguars might win another game but not two and the Jets are going 1-15 at the absolute best.

So basically we have no way of getting into the top 3 and I think Sewell is the only special uber non-QB prospect like a Chase Young, Bosa, Quinnen Williams, Saquon Barkley, etc. Without a chance at him I don't think there's a massive difference between picking at 6 vs. 9 vs. 12. Parsons might be near that level but I don't think he's as much of a sure-thing as Sewell is.

Of course if we fuck around and win the division picking at 19 would suck but there's probably an argument that the culture built under a 1st year coaching staff under those circumstances would outweigh 6-7 spots in the draft order.
 

Texas Ace

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Of course if we fuck around and win the division picking at 19 would suck but there's probably an argument that the culture built under a 1st year coaching staff under those circumstances would outweigh 6-7 spots in the draft order.
This..... All the way, this.
 

pd

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You started a thread that doesn’t ask to be a fan or not be a fan.

This is almost Ace circa 2010
 

Iamtdg

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If you made me choose between backing into the playoffs and pulling a one and done versus moving up 15 spots in the draft, I 'm choosing the better draft pick every time.
 

Cowboysrock55

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I was all for tanking for the third pick in the draft. But now I think I just want to win. Lifes too short to not enjoy some wins now that our pick isn't going to be in that top 3 range. Let this team start to win and develop something to build off for next year. And hell maybe we even win a playoff game. Probably not happening but we will likely get a wild card team in the first round so it's possible. The Vikes were playing like a wild card team before this week.
 

Rev

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Hard for me to get excited for any win when the ship is still being led by the clueless.
 

Genghis Khan

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I read through the gameday thread and it seems like we have mixed opinions on how we all want the season to finish.

Unlike past seasons, I can definitely see arguments for both whereas under Garrett I was all about losing out once I determined that the team wasn't good.

Personally, I'm glad they won today. I want them to win as much as possible.

If they lose every game and end up with a great draft pick, that's cool too. But this isn't like the Garrett years for me where once I knew they weren't going anywhere I just wanted them to tank for draft position or in hopes that we would eventually fire Garrett.

Unlike those years, this team stands more to lose by tanking and they also stand a lot more to gain by building momentum going into the next season.

McCarthy is coming back next year no matter what, so the last thing we need is for any of these players that will be returning next year to have any doubt in him or his staff. We need these players to believe in this staff and the direction they are going in heading into the 2021 season. That's why it's important to me that they take as many positives from this season as possible into the off-season.

The last few weeks have shown me that things are starting to click. The coaches are now becoming more familiar with what these players are best at, and the players are starting to understand better what it is the coaches are asking of them.

If there's such a thing as gracefully tanking, then I would love to see it. You finish 5-11 but you're competitive in every game. But if it turns into a 7 or 8 win season where they finish strong and win this shitty division, even if we all know that aren't going to do anything in the playoffs, I would be just fine with that outcome too because I think there's a lot of good that can come from it.

100% agree. Great post.
 

Genghis Khan

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if we fuck around and win the division picking at 19 would suck
I'm not even sure that would suck if we stick to our board and take someone that maybe should have gone a little higher. You can still find really good players around that spot.

And let's not forget we're going to have a couple extra middle round picks this draft. We'll still have a good chance of improving off of this draft.
 

Texas Ace

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I'm not even sure that would suck if we stick to our board and take someone that maybe should have gone a little higher. You can still find really good players around that spot.

And let's not forget we're going to have a couple extra middle round picks this draft. We'll still have a good chance of improving off of this draft.
I also think that this is going to be our most aggressive FA period in quite some time.

I'm not expecting a shopping spree or anything, but I do think we will go after some quality free agents this time around.

Couple that with a solid draft, and you should be able to plug 3 or 4 holes on the defensive side of the ball.

For me, the offense is fine as-is so long as they stay healthy. I would probably grab a talented lineman if he's there in the top 2 rounds and Zach Martin's flexibility allows you to go for either a tackle or an interior lineman.

With the right strategy in place, they can come away with a very successful offseason.
 

Genghis Khan

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I also think that this is going to be our most aggressive FA period in quite some time.
I hope so. I think we're in a spot right now where some smart shopping can really make a big difference.

I don't expect a spending spree either but you can find a quality 3T, a quality LB, and a quality safety without breaking the cap. Those three things would do wonders for this defense.

Putting our faith in 3 players in particular - Poe, Jaylon, and HaHa - really hurt us this year.
 

Simpleton

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I'm not even sure that would suck if we stick to our board and take someone that maybe should have gone a little higher. You can still find really good players around that spot.

And let's not forget we're going to have a couple extra middle round picks this draft. We'll still have a good chance of improving off of this draft.
We'd be able to get someone good but if the difference between winning the division and not is 13 slots in the order it'd be a bit rough, although I do think as someone in another thread said that this is not a legitimately bad team.

If we win the division at 6-10 we aren't a legitimate 6-10 team given the injury situation. Even if you just add a healthy Dak without a fully healthy OL this team probably wins 9 games, with a healthy OL you can probably bump that up to 10, and if the defense had been playing like this all year with a healthy Dak we'd almost certainly be in that 10-12 win range.

On the other hand a team like the Eagles or Giants seem to be legitimately bad teams, they have injuries but not one as catastrophic as Dak, on top of legitimately 2 of our top 7ish players in Smith/Collins also missing the year for all intents and purposes. They rest of the division truly is just limping along and if any of them win the division and drop 12 spots in the draft with a 6-10 record there is no cavalry coming to save them in 2021.
 

boozeman

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Not sure if you can tank with the division like this.

 

Simpleton

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This is the worst division in NFL history, at least modern NFL history, so yea.

It's a shame that Dak got hurt because otherwise we'd probably have the division wrapped up in about 2 weeks.
 

ravidubey

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I would like to see us tank.

Hard to see Andy Dalton winning in the playoffs. We have a puncher's chance to win round one, but four games in a row?

Meanwhile just reaching the playoffs drops our draft slot into the 20's.
 

Texas Ace

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I would like to see us tank.

Hard to see Andy Dalton winning in the playoffs. We have a puncher's chance to win round one, but four games in a row?

Meanwhile just reaching the playoffs drops our draft slot into the 20's.
But it's not about winning a SB or even a playoff game for that matter.

I don't think anyone here has any illusions about what this team will do if they somehow win the division.

This is about what it does for this team going into next year and in that regard, there is a lot that can be gained by finishing the season strong.
 

Iamtdg

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But it's not about winning a SB or even a playoff game for that matter.

I don't think anyone here has any illusions about what this team will do if they somehow win the division.

This is about what it does for this team going into next year and in that regard, there is a lot that can be gained by finishing the season strong.
Yeah, I can see that. Get some confidence in themselves and their teammates built up going into next year. This team is mostly going to stay intact next year minus probable the secondary, so the vast majority of these guys will be together again next year.
 
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