Machota: With 'Senator' Byron Jones, Cowboys drafted more than just a workout warrior

Safety and MLB in this defense are going to get abused until we beef up the interior DL.

I prefer Jeff Heath takes those hits, not a guy we drafted to be our #1CB.

Last year's playoffs showed just how bad the Cowboys pass coverage was vs. elite talent. And I'm not talking about the 1st WR, but the second and third ones.
 
ravidubey said:
Last year's playoffs showed just how bad the Cowboys pass coverage was vs. elite talent. And I'm not talking about the 1st WR, but the second and third ones.
Click to expand...

You are misdiagnosing the primary reason.

It was pass rush, not lack of talent at CB. Sure, Claiborne struggled and Patmon/Moore were nothing special, but theres nothing wrong with Carr and Scandrick.

Upgrading fourth corner isn't nearly as important to the defense as upgrading free safety, now that the pass rush is fixed.
 
mschmidt64 said:
You are misdiagnosing the primary reason.

It was pass rush, not lack of talent at CB. Sure, Claiborne struggled and Patmon/Moore were nothing special, but theres nothing wrong with Carr and Scandrick.

Upgrading fourth corner isn't nearly as important to the defense as upgrading free safety, now that the pass rush is fixed.
Click to expand...

We hope the pass rush is fixed. Hardy hopefully iwill get some relief otherwise he is out most of the season. Gregory has a lot of upside but is a rookie. Lawrence is virtually a rookie so I think there is room for reservation at the moment.
 
Last edited:
L.T. Fan said:
We hope the pass rush is fixed. Hardy hopefully iwill get some relief otherwise he is out most of the season. Gregory has a lot of upside but is a rookie. Lawrence is virtually a rookie so I think there is room for reservation at the moment.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't call Lawrence virtually a rookie. He was injured half his Rookie season. But so was Sean Lee. He came on strong in the playoffs. His physique (which is what limits most rookie lineman) should reflect an offseason of work.
 
townsend said:
I wouldn't call Lawrence virtually a rookie. He was injured half his Rookie season. But so was Sean Lee. He came on strong in the playoffs. His physique (which is what limits most rookie lineman) should reflect an offseason of work.
Click to expand...

He might do very well but as a practical matter he will begin the season with less than 8 games under his belt. Thats still rookie territory.
 
mschmidt64 said:
You are misdiagnosing the primary reason.

It was pass rush, not lack of talent at CB. Sure, Claiborne struggled and Patmon/Moore were nothing special, but theres nothing wrong with Carr and Scandrick.

Upgrading fourth corner isn't nearly as important to the defense as upgrading free safety, now that the pass rush is fixed.
Click to expand...

Rodgers' inability to escape the pocket even things up quite a bit and Dallas had two sacks and a forced fumble on him-- much more than most teams get against Rodgers.

I'm only telling you what the Cowboys brought Jones in to do. You are also implying the quality of coverage didn't matter, which is false.

Had it been merely the pass rush alone then we'd have seen Jordy Nelson light us up and never had any turnovers or sacks on Rodgers.

Instead Rodgers used the extra time our weak pass rush gave him to expose ridiculous mismatches against his second and third options, Randall Cobb and Davante Adams.

Adams had 38 catches with an 11.7 average in the regular season and 7/117 for 16.7 against Dallas.

They beat the Patriots by the same 26-21 margin using the same mismatch of Adams on the third CB and Cobb on the 2nd with Nelson getting an identical 2 catches.

The 3 sacks the Pats racked up were meaningless in isolation vs. a QB like Rodgers who can beat you on any single play. It takes a concerted effort of coverage and pass rush.

Anyways, Dallas improved in both areas from last year, which is exciting. Now we have to hope and pray they can squeeze the most possible out of Randle, Williams, and D-mac-- among the worst RB stables in the conference.
 
ravidubey said:
You are also implying the quality of coverage didn't matter, which is false.
Click to expand...

I'm not implying anything. I'm telling you straight up that Scandrick-Carr-White-Patmon are just fine as your top 4 CBs if your pass rush isn't bottom of the barrel like ours has been. And if Claiborne gives us anything that's even better.

Byron Jones is overkill at the position and much more valuable feeding off that pass rush by using his athleticism to prowl the middle of the field defending passes... If he's capable of it like we've heard.
 
mschmidt64 said:
I'm not implying anything. I'm telling you straight up that Scandrick-Carr-White-Patmon are just fine as your top 4 CBs if your pass rush isn't bottom of the barrel like ours has been. And if Claiborne gives us anything that's even better.

Byron Jones is overkill at the position and much more valuable feeding off that pass rush by using his athleticism to prowl the middle of the field defending passes... If he's capable of it like we've heard.
Click to expand...

I agree. Putting Jones at FS ensures our top 4 defensive backs are always on the field.
 
mschmidt64 said:
I'm not implying anything. I'm telling you straight up that Scandrick-Carr-White-Patmon are just fine as your top 4 CBs if your pass rush isn't bottom of the barrel like ours has been. And if Claiborne gives us anything that's even better.

Byron Jones is overkill at the position and much more valuable feeding off that pass rush by using his athleticism to prowl the middle of the field defending passes... If he's capable of it like we've heard.
Click to expand...

How in the hell do you know Patmon and White are fine being your 3 and 4th CB's?

We all know you are projecting Patmon because of a INT he had thrown right to him which is reaching a lot but please tell us what you have seen of white to make you think this way.

I am not saying Jones is not utilized better at safety but to say he is overkill before camp even starts is hyperbole even for you.
 
townsend said:
I agree. Putting Jones at FS ensures our top 4 defensive backs are always on the field.
Click to expand...

Sure it's possible, but then he's out of position and making tackles which is not what he's built for at all.

An NFL FS and a MLB center fielder are *barely* alike. Sure we all imagine Ed Reed back there intercepting errant passes, but the FS's #1 job is run support.

Reed distinguished himself with an amazing 113 p-defs in 174 games, but his 531 tackles were his primary responsibility. And he was fortunate to have an all-time great front seven most of his career taking the brunt of those tackles. Ronnie Lott, a FS for most of his career, had 1113 tackles.

Just watch Jones' film-- he's hardly a physical guy and now we're asking him to tackle DeMarco Murray and Jimmy Graham as his main job? Dabbling at FS at UCONN isn't the NFL.

Jones is a CB and was drafted to be a CB to address weaknesses at CB.

And I doubt our pass rush becomes this studly juggernaut despite the improved DE talent.

For one, we have poor interior pressure because our 1-tech can't stop the QB from stepping up.

Then Gregory is a rookie and both he and Lawrence are undersized and largely unproven at this level. I applaud Lawrence's play in the playoffs, but it doesn't mean he's this great budding pass rusher.

Hardy is the real addition, but he will have serious rust. We also don't know that the monster that dominated in Carolina even still exists.

The Cowboys took note of what Cobb and Adams did to New England and Dallas, and so did Green Bay-- hence Dallas drafted a CB and GB resigned Cobb to #1 WR money. Those moves are no coincidence.

Did I want a CB? No. I wanted Brown, but we got a CB specifically to play CB.
 
I don't agree that the main priority for a FS is run support. To me they serve basically as a 3rd CB.
 
Carp said:
I don't agree that the main priority for a FS is run support. To me they serve basically as a 3rd CB.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I don't agree with that, either. That was a strange comment. The SS is the box safety, supporting the run first. The FS roams free covering from sideline to sideline, usually over the top of the deep pass. Considering they line up around 15-20 yards off the ball, I wouldn't say their #1 job is run support.
 
I'll definitely put the caveat that this is all with the assumption that Jones can actually play FS.

If he can't then he's just another non-elite corner most likely.
 
Carp said:
I don't agree that the main priority for a FS is run support. To me they serve basically as a 3rd CB.
Click to expand...

NoDak said:
Yeah, I don't agree with that, either. That was a strange comment. The SS is the box safety, supporting the run first. The FS roams free covering from sideline to sideline, usually over the top of the deep pass. Considering they line up around 15-20 yards off the ball, I wouldn't say their #1 job is run support.
Click to expand...

I understand this take since it appears like FS's do just about everything, but they don't have man coverage on a single WR like a CB would and so are looking back in run support. They may line up 15-20 yards back but then they fly to the football on every play.

Think about every play-action pass you ever saw, the intent is to draw the safeties, not CB's. Because of their position on the field, they can close in on any play. This means a FS will have 1.5 to double the tackles of a CB.

And if their front seven sucks, especially in the middle, they will have even more tackles and definitely take a beating.

I think if we had a stronger front seven, Jones could play FS.

Regardless of what I think, if he does indeed play FS, then they should commit to him at FS for this entire season and not move him around.
 
If I'm not mistaken Free Safety used to be called a rover back. The went wherever the ball went.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom