LOL @ The Eagles

According to Google, Brandin Cooks was traded for a first twice although it wasn't straight up.

2017 Trade: The New Orleans Saints traded Cooks and a 4th-round pick to the New England Patriots in exchange for the 32nd overall pick (a 1st-rounder) and a 3rd-round pick.

2018 Trade: The New England Patriots traded Cooks and a 4th-round pick to the Los Angeles Rams in exchange for a 1st-round pick (23rd overall) and a 6th-round pick.
 
Smitty said:
I don’t understand how they keep doing this.

They only gave up a first for him. Now they get back a first and change.

HOW DO THEY KEEP DOING THIS
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They don't fall in love with and cling to their own players.

They actually shop to leverage the talent they have.

I think the Patriots are more desperate for immediate WR help than they let on, given their window is literally now, and Philly has to think longer term as their own window closed (at least with Brown) a bit last season losing to a depleted 49ers team with Brown only catching 3 passes in the game.

This is why trades down in first round were that much easier this past draft with a good group of 1st round WR talents available. So much so that Philly was willing to trade two 4ths to Dallas to move up a few spots to get one.

What's surprising to me was how people, especially the Pats, over-valued Brown. Maybe they believe Maye can actually connect with him and develop the long term chemistry Hurts couldn't. Brown has what, three or four more effective seasons left?
 
Smitty said:
I don’t understand how they keep doing this.

They only gave up a first for him. Now they get back a first and change.

HOW DO THEY KEEP DOING THIS
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They traded a still very good WR towards the back end of his prime for effectively a 2nd, that's not some big steal, it's roughly market value for a guy who was still one of their top 5 players.

You're just looking at it through the lens of an incompetent organization like ours who sent out Cooper for a 5th.
 
Jaylen Waddle is only a year younger than Brown and nowhere near the player, but the Dolphins effectively got a 1st and a 3rd for Waddle about a month before the draft. Picks available to Miami just a few weeks after the trade.

Compare that to Brown, the better player, who is getting a 1st two years from now, so effectively a 2nd in 2027.

Roseman is a shrewd operator but this is nowhere near the kind of heists he got for Wentz and that shitty LB that went to Miami, and in fact it might even be a win for the Patriots when you consider what Waddle went for.
 
Simpleton said:
Jaylen Waddle is only a year younger than Brown and nowhere near the player, but the Dolphins effectively got a 1st and a 3rd for Waddle about a month before the draft. Picks available to Miami just a few weeks after the trade.

Compare that to Brown, the better player, who is getting a 1st two years from now, so effectively a 2nd in 2027.

Roseman is a shrewd operator but this is nowhere near the kind of heists he got for Wentz and that shitty LB that went to Miami, and in fact it might even be a win for the Patriots when you consider what Waddle went for.
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Yes, and a 2027 2nd would have been worth a 2026 3rd this past April.

Howie’s now left hoping the bottom falls out for the Patriots so his late-looking 2028 1st matures into a mid round 1st
 
We can do all the mental gymnastics in the world and pretend a first isn't a first, but I assure you when 2028 rolls around that will still be a first. And it will suck when that year gets here and they get to double dip in the actual first round.

They got more than they should have for a guy who is about to be 29 and has been good not great for two years running now.

Go ahead and compare him to the Waddle deal but Denver also over paid. Both can be true.
 
Genghis Khan said:
We can do all the mental gymnastics in the world and pretend a first isn't a first, but I assure you when 2028 rolls around that will still be a first. And it will suck when that year gets here and they get to double dip in the actual first round.

They got more than they should have for a guy who is about to be 29 and has been good not great for two years running now.

Go ahead and compare him to the Waddle deal but Denver also over paid. Both can be true.
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I agree, patience is how NFL GMs win. Many GMs and coaches won't do it because they don't know if they will even be with the team come the 2028 draft. But the name of the game is to always be adding future draft capital. If you do that you will always have an advantage over every other NFL team.

Team wants to trade a future first for a second round pick in a draft? You do it every time. Anyway, I'm not shocked Roseman pulled off a heist but I'm disappointed that the Patriots gave him a first. Even if it's in 2028.

The Eagles will probably be in rebuild mode soon and they just set themselves up to rebuild faster when that happens. Which is what they are really good at doing.
 
Cowboysrock55 said:
they don't know if they will even be with the team come the 2028 draft.
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That's a great point and has a lot to do with it.

Roseman's job is one of the safest in the league outside of Jerry so he's very comfortable waiting while a lot of GMs aren't.
 
Yep, that should be one of the actual "unique advantages" of having our wonderful unfirable GM. But we never do it.
 
Genghis Khan said:
We can do all the mental gymnastics in the world and pretend a first isn't a first, but I assure you when 2028 rolls around that will still be a first. And it will suck when that year gets here and they get to double dip in the actual first round.

They got more than they should have for a guy who is about to be 29 and has been good not great for two years running now.

Go ahead and compare him to the Waddle deal but Denver also over paid. Both can be true.
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There's no mental gymnastics, that's generally how the league views future picks in terms of a 1 two years from now being valued as a 2 a year earlier, it's not some coup of a trade.

Maybe the Pats suck in 2027 and it's a top 10 pick, maybe they go to the AFCC and it's 29 two years from now, but generally speaking that's how these future picks are viewed and you can't value a 1 two years from now the same as a 1 next year.

Either way, Brown was one of their top 5 players and they have to wait two years to cash in losing him, we'll see how it turns out but something tells me they're going to be kinda shit the next two years.
 
Yeah, I think they're going to miss him a lot. No one else can give that physical presence like he did. Smith is a twig as we know and Stevie Lemon is a slot guy.
 
Simpleton said:
There's no mental gymnastics, that's generally how the league views future picks in terms of a 1 two years from now being valued as a 2 a year earlier, it's not some coup of a trade.

Maybe the Pats suck in 2027 and it's a top 10 pick, maybe they go to the AFCC and it's 29 two years from now, but generally speaking that's how these future picks are viewed and you can't value a 1 two years from now the same as a 1 next year.

Either way, Brown was one of their top 5 players and they have to wait two years to cash in losing him, we'll see how it turns out but something tells me they're going to be kinda shit the next two years.
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It might be how the league views future picks, but it's also a market inefficiency that Roseman has exploited.

I know the rule of thumb is that a second this year is worth a first next year but in nearly every situation I'd prefer the first next year.

The exception would be the rare situation where a Drew Brees has fallen to the top of the second round and I have to get him now.
 
Yeah it’s going to suck in 2028, but in the mean time the Eagles have traded away a consistent 1000 yard #1 WR to a contender!

WR is a top three impactful position in the NFL and so teams are willing to overpay. And after a time, if everyone ‘overpays’, is it really overpaying anymore.

Answer is no, it’s not just in case you thought that wasn’t rhetorical.

Two transactions sets the market, but the market only reflects how vital the position is.

The Cowboys are flush at WR, so maybe it’s harder to see that teams without one would pay a lot to get one.
 
Smitty said:
It might be how the league views future picks, but it's also a market inefficiency that Roseman has exploited.

I know the rule of thumb is that a second this year is worth a first next year but in nearly every situation I'd prefer the first next year.

The exception would be the rare situation where a Drew Brees has fallen to the top of the second round and I have to get him now.
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I mean it definitely helps us for the next 2 seasons.
 
ravidubey said:
if everyone ‘overpays’, is it really overpaying anymore.

Answer is no, it’s not just in case you thought that wasn’t rhetorical.
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Yes actually. This isn't Bitcoin or a stamp collection. You have to get actual value for what you're paying. You can't just pay a first for say, Deebo Samuel and just throw up your hands and say it's fine because that's the going price for receivers nowadays.

That's not to say Brown is Deebo. But let's say Brown puts up this year the average of his past two seasons - about 70 catches and about 1000 yards. Was that worth a first? No, because you can get that type of production a lot cheaper than that.

NE paid for the guy Brown was 3 seasons ago. Maybe he gets back to that. Maybe. But it's enough of an uncertainty and risk that he shouldn't have commanded a premium price tag.
 
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