Super Bowl LI Gameday Chatter | Patriots v. Falcons | 2/5/17

[Texas Ace]

Many head coaches don't have the stones to actually override a strong coordinator. Also, there seems to be a case where the same "vision" is not shared.

Yea, Mike Ditka/Buddy Ryan situations seemed to be rare back then whereas now, it's pretty common. And then you had the 93 Oilers situation which also consisted of Ryan and then OC Kevin Gilbride all being led by an empty suit in Jack Pardee.

Nowadays, there are plenty of both offensive and defensive coordinators that are kinda just left to do whatever the hell they want and as you said, their philosophies differ from one another and yet there they remain on the staff together.

 

[Rev]

Tom Bradyand the Patriots run 93 plays. In contrast, NFL MVP Matt Ryan and the Falcons ran 46 plays. The 47-play difference marked the biggest play disparity in NFL postseason history, according to the Elias Sports Bureau.
The Patriots had two drives that lasted more than five minutes in the second half, including a 13-play, 75-yard touchdown drive resulting in 6 minutes, 25 seconds coming off the clock. For the game, the Patriots had the ball for 40:31, while the Falcons had it for 23:27.

I thought Dak and dunk couldn't win. Imagine that.

 

[mcnuttz]

Most Falcons fans are extremely fickle, and only give a shit about the team when they're playing well.

So this isn't going to hurt them for long, nor will they be apprehensive to jump back on the wagon the next time.

They just really don't give a damn.

 

[Cotton]

I thought Dak and dunk couldn't win. Imagine that.

Yeah, that whole premise is dumb.

 

[ravidubey]

I thought Dak and dunk couldn't win. Imagine that.

That wasn't Dak and dunk.

It was Brady taking whatever the defense gave him in the face of constant pressure, an Atlanta team that gave up on the running game in spite of a 25 point lead, and a defense that was completely exhausted after being on the field for so many plays as a result of the abandoned run.

Dak doesn't face pressure like that thanks to Zeke and the OL. We choose to conservatively step down the field and became the first top seed in years to go one and done. Yay us.

Recall Ryan's 4 of 5 on 20+ passing deep that got them that lead. Without that, the game is a surefire Falcon loss and you know it.

They were three kneel-downs from a win. Who knows why the idiots went shotgun.

 

[DLK150]

I know that the NFL is a pass first league and has been for years but when you've got a substantial lead 67% of the way through a title game, you have to engage some type of strategy when you're playing a top notch opponent. The SB isn't week three on the road against the bottom of the barrel in the NFL. What got you to where you are will not always get you all the way to the top. To me, that's lazy coaching.

 

[Rev]

That wasn't Dak and dunk.

It was Brady taking whatever the defense gave him in the face of constant pressure, an Atlanta team that gave up on the running game in spite of a 25 point lead, and a defense that was completely exhausted after being on the field for so many plays as a result of the abandoned run.

Dak doesn't face pressure like that thanks to Zeke and the OL. We choose to conservatively step down the field and became the first top seed in years to go one and done. Yay us.

Recall Ryan's 4 of 5 on 20+ passing deep that got them that lead. Without that, the game is a surefire Falcon loss and you know it.

They were three kneel-downs from a win. Who knows why the idiots went shotgun.

Ok.

 

[Cotton]

That wasn't Dak and dunk.

It was Brady taking whatever the defense gave him in the face of constant pressure, an Atlanta team that gave up on the running game in spite of a 25 point lead, and a defense that was completely exhausted after being on the field for so many plays as a result of the abandoned run.

Dak doesn't face pressure like that thanks to Zeke and the OL. We choose to conservatively step down the field and became the first top seed in years to go one and done. Yay us.

Recall Ryan's 4 of 5 on 20+ passing deep that got them that lead. Without that, the game is a surefire Falcon loss and you know it.

They were three kneel-downs from a win. Who knows why the idiots went shotgun.

 

[ravidubey]

In spite of the pressure, NE also had four passes of 23 yards or more.

 

[data]

In spite of the pressure, NE also had four passes of 23 yards or more.

So the difference between dink-and-dunk and a championship caliber offense is 4 passes of 23+ yards?

 

[Jiggyfly]

 

[Cowboysrock55]

So the difference between dink-and-dunk and a championship caliber offense is 4 passes of 23+ yards?

I love how he picked 23 yards. When his usual standard for what constitutes a big play is 25+ yards. Something tells me he is fudging the numbers to fit his argument.

 

[data]

Dak Prescott's Adjusted-Yards-per-Attempt compared to the other Final Four QBs since 2010 (excludes 2015 Peyton, but includes 2014 Romo). From Pro Football Reference

Ranking #8-of-22 doesn't look dink-and-dunk to me. It's petty to say Dak's offense (or choosing Dak over Romo) isn't good enough for a deep playoff run...Only credible criticism is that the Cowboys passing offense (Romo & Dak), while good enough for better all-around teams, isn't dominating enough to compensate for our penchant for untimely playcalling, penalties & defensive failures. This is evident by Tom Brady being bottom 3-of-6 on this list, but is afforded this by the discipline of the rest of his team.

Year	QB	Completion %	Adj Yards/Attempt
2016 2014 2016 2013 2014 2015 2011 2016 2013 2010 2010 2015 2011 2014 2014 2013 2015 2014 2016 2011 2012 2013	Matt Ryan Aaron Rodgers Tom Brady Peyton Manning Tony Romo Carson Palmer Tom Brady Dak Prescott Russell Wilson Roethlisberger Aaron Rodgers Cam Newton Eli Manning Russell Wilson Andrew Luck Kaepernick Tom Brady Tom Brady Roethlisberger Alex Smith Joe Flacco Tom Brady	69.9% 65.6% 67.4% 68.3% 69.9% 63.7% 65.6% 67.8% 63.1% 61.7% 65.7% 59.8% 61.0% 63.1% 61.7% 58.4% 64.1% 64.1% 64.4% 61.3% 59.7% 60.5%	10.1 9.5 9.3 9.3 9.1 9.1 9.0 8.6 8.5 8.5 8.4 8.3 8.1 7.9 7.9 7.8 7.5 7.5 7.5 7.3 7.2 6.9

 

[ravidubey]

I love how he picked 23 yards. When his usual standard for what constitutes a big play is 25+ yards. Something tells me he is fudging the numbers to fit his argument.

One pass was 23, the others were 25 or over. So yeah I fudged. Those are all difference-making plays that threaten the defense.

BTW, it's not dink and dunk. It's dink and Dak. There's a difference. Dak' rookie approach beats most teams in the league, but can't take you far into the playoffs.

I was so excited after Detroit. I actually thought they were going to uncork the offense and let fly while maintaining a 50-50 balance.

Instead they did exactly the opposite and we lost our last two games.

 

[data]

One pass was 23, the others were 25 or over. So yeah I fudged. Those are all difference-making plays that threaten the defense.

BTW, it's not dink and dunk. It's dink and Dak. There's a difference. Dak' rookie approach beats most teams in the league, but can't take you far into the playoffs.

I was so excited after Detroit. I actually thought they were going to uncork the offense and let fly while maintaining a 50-50 balance.

So, Detroit is your approved example of a 'championship caliber offense'. Looking at the throw chart (link to Sturm article), Dak had 3-of-20 passes 23+ yards. That's 15%.

However, you cite dink-and-Dak during the Green Bay loss. Dak threw 5-of-38 passes 23+ yards, which is 13% (link to throw chart). So the difference is 2%. Your whoooooooole gripe...based on 2%.

Furthermore, Detroit's game had 11 passes for <7 yards (55%). Green Bay's game had 16 passes (42%).

So you're cool with +50% passes for short as long as 15% pass are deep. That's your standard for 'championship caliber offense'.

Instead they did exactly the opposite and we lost our last two games.

Hyperbole, right? You can't blame dink-and-Dak for our Philadelphia loss.

 

[townsend]

Hyperbole, right? You can't blame dink-and-Dak for our Philadelphia loss.

Should blame Sanch-and-sack for that.

 

[Simpleton]

Let's just assume for a second that what ravid is saying is right, which I don't agree with, but let's just assume for a second.

It's like people forget that Prescott is/was a rookie.

Atlanta in 2010 was in a similar position as we were this year, with homefield and a red hot Aaron Rodgers coming into Atlanta. Rodgers was unbelievable in that game, much like he was against us a month ago, Green Bay built a huge lead early and Atlanta never responded, Ryan ended up going 20/29 for 186 yards with 1 TD and 2 INT's in that game, in his third year in the league.

And that was Ryan's third year in the league.

Let's give Prescott a few years before we start comparing him to 10 year vets.

 

[data]

Let's just assume for a second that what ravid is saying is right, which I don't agree with, but let's just assume for a second.

It's like people forget that Prescott is/was a rookie.

Atlanta in 2010 was in a similar position as we were this year, with homefield and a red hot Aaron Rodgers coming into Atlanta. Rodgers was unbelievable in that game, much like he was against us a month ago, Green Bay built a huge lead early and Atlanta never responded, Ryan ended up going 20/29 for 186 yards with 1 TD and 2 INT's in that game, in his third year in the league.

And that was Ryan's third year in the league.

Let's give Prescott a few years before we start comparing him to 10 year vets.

Can't use the 'Dak is a rookie excuse', though. Ravid's theory of dink-and-Dak is the evolutionary result that started with Romo should've been the mid-season starter. Romo presents us a better chance to get to the promised land this year. Meanwhile, we'd be saved from the bus drivin' rookie, as he cocoons on the bench, emerging as this downfield, gunslinging butterfly in 2017/2018.

 

[L.T. Fan]

Can't use the 'Dak is a rookie excuse', though. Ravid's theory of dink-and-Dak is the evolutionary result that started with Romo should've been the mid-season starter. Romo presents us a better chance to get to the promised land this year. Meanwhile, we'd be saved from the bus drivin' rookie, as he cocoons on the bench, emerging as this downfield, gunslinging butterfly in 2017/2018.

That's the story that was presented by some during the season with a few caveats but will forever be something to be pondered.

 

[skidadl]

Let's just assume for a second that what ravid is saying is right, which I don't agree with, but let's just assume for a second.

It's like people forget that Prescott is/was a rookie.

Atlanta in 2010 was in a similar position as we were this year, with homefield and a red hot Aaron Rodgers coming into Atlanta. Rodgers was unbelievable in that game, much like he was against us a month ago, Green Bay built a huge lead early and Atlanta never responded, Ryan ended up going 20/29 for 186 yards with 1 TD and 2 INT's in that game, in his third year in the league.

And that was Ryan's third year in the league.

Let's give Prescott a few years before we start comparing him to 10 year vets.

Yeah, it is pretty ridiculous. First we were doomed to being 4-12 and then we had a miracle rookie season and now we have an inept coaching staff because we didn't go deep. All of that happened to happen while we had a rookie QB. Sheesh.