President Biden thread...

[Cotton]

for the same reason I don't support term limits.

You lost me there, brother.

 

[NoDak]

You lost me there, brother.

I was thinking the same thing. Not sure how the cousins wife’s brothers best friends neighbor could help out with that.

 

[Genghis Khan]

You lost me there, brother.

My issue with that is that I don't think term limits would solve anything either.

If there were term limits, what would happen to someone like Nancy pelosi for example? Would that keep her from being a career politician? Almost certainly not.

She would likely just move on to either a different government position, a position within the DNC, or a lobbyist. And the machine would just keep getting the next Pelosi type elected.

Case in point - are Hillary Clinton and Barrack Obama still influencing policy despite not holding a government position for years now? If the answer is yes (and it is), then that's essentially all the evidence you need that term limits would be ineffective in curtailing the corruption as intended.

But what it would do is keep talented and important good people from effecting positive change over the long term, because those are the types of people that follow rules and don't tend to pull strings from the shadows.

 

[Cotton]

My issue with that is that I don't think term limits would solve anything either.

If there were term limits, what would happen to someone like Nancy pelosi for example? Would that keep her from being a career politician? Almost certainly not.

She would likely just move on to either a different government position, a position within the DNC, or a lobbyist. And the machine would just keep getting the next Pelosi type elected.

Case in point - are Hillary Clinton and Barrack Obama still influencing policy despite not holding a government position for years now? If the answer is yes (and it is), then that's essentially all the evidence you need that term limits would be ineffective in curtailing the corruption as intended.

But what it would do is keep talented and important good people from effecting positive change over the long term, because those are the types of people that follow rules and don't tend to pull strings from the shadows.

Lobbying. Lobbying is what term limits helps with. I'm tired of these politicians going in middle class and coming out millionaires.

 

[Genghis Khan]

Lobbying. Lobbying is what term limits helps with. I'm tired of these politicians going in middle class and coming out millionaires.

I don't see - at all - how term limits helps limit lobbying.

You might even see more lobbyists.

 

[Cotton]

I don't see - at all - how term limits helps limit lobbying.

You might even see more lobbyists.

It would greatly reduce money in politics. There is a reason these people decide to be career politicians. The longer they are in power the more money they make. Can you imagine how much money was made by them from big pharma during the plandemic?

 

[Genghis Khan]

It would greatly reduce money in politics. There is a reason these people decide to be career politicians. The longer they are in power the more money they make. Can you imagine how much money was made by them from big pharma during the plandemic?

How would it greatly or at all reduce money in politics? The lobbyists would still be there. I'm sure they don't care if they funnel money to, say, Pelosi or to Pelosi's replacement.

 

[Cotton]

How would it greatly or at all reduce money in politics? The lobbyists would still be there. I'm sure they don't care if they funnel money to, say, Pelosi or to Pelosi's replacement.

We just will have to agree to disagree on this one. Term limits are needed, badly.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

We just will have to agree to disagree on this one. Term limits are needed, badly.

Yeah I'm surprised Geng isn't on board with these things. Does he just blanket agree with insider trading and career politicians?

I mean he is literally arguing that he doesn't want it while saying term limits and trading aren't part of the problem? Maybe he is wanting a culling at the end of terms?

 

[Genghis Khan]

Yeah I'm surprised Geng isn't on board with these things. Does he just blanket agree with insider trading and career politicians?

I mean he is literally arguing that he doesn't want it while saying term limits and trading aren't part of the problem? Maybe he is wanting a culling at the end of terms?

No, I'm saying term limits and bans on congressional trading doesn't solve the problem, and I have yet to hear a convincing argument to the contrary.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

No, I'm saying term limits and bans on congressional trading doesn't solve the problem, and I have yet to hear a convincing argument to the contrary.

I mean take one at a time. Allowing insider trading for politicians for example. You're talking about the same problem you have with all insider trading. What if the person with actual knowledge passes on the information to someone else who makes the trade. Well that's also a well established crime and if you get caught you go to jail. Your argument is basically the same for legalizing insider trading for all.

Term limits as far as I'm concerned is a step in the right direction. Sure Nancy Pelosi can find another way to have influence. But you're cutting off the strongest position, the one where she makes the actual vote.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

It wouldn't have mattered if it had been on the books anyway... The DOJ and SEC wouldn't have prosecuted it.

 

[Genghis Khan]

Allowing insider trading for politicians for example. You're talking about the same problem you have with all insider trading. What if the person with actual knowledge passes on the information to someone else who makes the trade. Well that's also a well established crime and if you get caught you go to jail. Your argument is basically the same for legalizing insider trading for all.

No, I'm saying prosecute insider trading when Congress does it just like they would any other citizen. Yes, the laws are already on the books. Enforce it on Congress. I don't like the unintended consequences of banning Congress from trading and I don't think it would be effective anyway.

Term limits as far as I'm concerned is a step in the right direction. Sure Nancy Pelosi can find another way to have influence. But you're cutting off the strongest position, the one where she makes the actual vote.

It wouldn't solve anything. The problem is with the seat and the party machines not the person in the seat. Rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic doesn't solve the problem.

I don't know what would solve the problem, but I don't think term limits do. I suspect transparency will help a lot.

The presidency has term limits. Did term limits prevent Biden from being one of the most corrupt presidents ever?

 

[Irving Cowboy]

We just will have to agree to disagree on this one. Term limits are needed, badly.

Politics was never meant to be a lifelong career, anyway.

 

[Irving Cowboy]

The presidency has term limits.

Steve Bannon begs to differ with you.

 

[Genghis Khan]

Politics was never meant to be a lifelong career, anyway.

Among other public offices, Thomas Jefferson was President, Vice President, Secretary of State, Ambassador to France, and Governor of Virginia.

John Adams was President, Vice President, diplomat to France, the Netherlands, and Great Britain, and a justice in Massachusetts.

James Madison was President, Vice President, Secretary of State, and a US Congressman.

James Monroe was President, Vice President, Secretary of State, Secretary of War, Governor of Virginia, and a US senator.

That's not even mentioning second generation politicians like Henry Clay, Daniel Webster, John C Calhoun and John Quincy Adams, all of whom had essentially lifelong careers in politics.

Outside of George Washington, politics has been a lifelong career basically since the inception of the country.

 

[Genghis Khan]

Steve Bannon begs to differ with you.

I don't know what this means but the President definitely has term limits.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

No, I'm saying prosecute insider trading when Congress does it just like they would any other citizen. Yes, the laws are already on the books. Enforce it on Congress. I don't like the unintended consequences of banning Congress from trading and I don't think it would be effective anyway.

It has no unintended consequences in my opinion. It just cuts off an obvious and easy avenue for members to commit and get away with a crime. I'm all for making it harder for a criminal to commit a crime.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

The presidency has term limits. Did term limits prevent Biden from being one of the most corrupt presidents ever?

No but it did stop Obama from still being your President today. Are you telling me you'd rather have Obama on his fifth term as opposed to what has transpired? See how the term limits changed things? Trump would have never been President at all.

What term limits do is prevent someone from using the system to keep themselves in power forever. Sort of like you see in congress.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I don't know what this means but the President definitely has term limits.

Bannon is a very smart guy but he does troll the Dems sometimes, and Irv fell for it.