Cowboys Free Agency Thread

Plan9Misfit

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I'm with you on that. Treat him and Gregory both as bonuses if they pan out. Don't let it affect how you draft. Act like they aren't even on the team going into draft day.
I don't trust that will be the approach, though. It's not like anyone else was going to sign him, so we certainly could've waited until after the draft. I fear this will skew their perception of need and the overall approach, which means a CB in the 1st round.
 

ravidubey

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Resulting in picks like Taco Charlton.
There are always draft busts and we like every team have good drafts and bad drafts. At least there is detailed input from every coach and scout vs. a lot of fan opinions formed from watching a sampling of games and net highlights continuously altered by a community discussion.
 

Simpleton

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I think there is a swell of support on this board for Chaisson and there is concern we will overlook him now. That's all.
It's not just Chaisson, if we took McKinney in the 1st and Weaver in the 2nd I'd be pretty thrilled.

Or Baun after trading down to 25 or so, which might be what I'd prefer in general.

If it were me I'd still go after Griffen or Clowney while cutting Crawford but I know that has a 0.0% chance of happening.

It's not about Chaisson specifically, it's more about ignoring one of the most important positions where we have only one reliable player.
 

NoDak

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There are always draft busts and we like every team have good drafts and bad drafts. At least there is detailed input from every coach and scout vs. a lot of fan opinions formed from watching a sampling of games and net highlights continuously altered by a community discussion.
Just smile and nod...
 

Cowboysrock55

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I remember we also had a pet cat in 2017 named TJ Watt. How'd that turn out again?
:unsure
See and I loved TJ Watt. I loved his production of 15.5 sacks his last year in college, I loved his bloodlines coming from a family of athletes and I loved his build being a long 6'5" with athletic ability. In hindsight it just looks like a slam dunk that he would be good. But a lot of teams missed the boat for some reason.
 

Simpleton

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There are always draft busts and we like every team have good drafts and bad drafts. At least there is detailed input from every coach and scout vs. a lot of fan opinions formed from watching a sampling of games and net highlights continuously altered by a community discussion.
I can guarantee you that my opinion on Chaisson has nothing to do with groupthink or highlight videos.

I watched literally every snap Chaisson played against Georgia, Oklahoma, Florida, Alabama and Clemson. Every snap of Henderson's against FSU, Georgia, Auburn and LSU.

And it wasn't even these 7 minute cut-up videos on YouTube, the entire games are on there and I went through each of them, except for I think FSU where there was only a condensed version. It's not All-22 unfortunately but for OL/DL you aren't missing too much, and for Henderson I couldn't watch him all the way throughout every single snap but I for damn sure could see the multiple times he got roasted for 40+ yard receptions, including an All-22 view where you can discern the overall coverage.

I can also tell you that that scouts often times don't watch every single game of a prospect, it usually is a sampling of about 5 or so, spread out throughout the season so you aren't watching just games from the beginning/middle/end of the year.

I just got around to watching them seriously now because it's looking like they're the top two options at 17, and of course scouting isn't my job so I don't have basically my entire life to devote to breaking down film.
 

Stasheroo

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There are always draft busts and we like every team have good drafts and bad drafts. At least there is detailed input from every coach and scout vs. a lot of fan opinions formed from watching a sampling of games and net highlights continuously altered by a community discussion.
And as has been proven, sometimes the fans get it right and the team gets it wrong.

Facts.
 

Stasheroo

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See and I loved TJ Watt. I loved his production of 15.5 sacks his last year in college, I loved his bloodlines coming from a family of athletes and I loved his build being a long 6'5" with athletic ability. In hindsight it just looks like a slam dunk that he would be good. But a lot of teams missed the boat for some reason.
Other teams missing the boat doesn't excuse us however.

"If everyone else jumped off the bridge..."
 

Stasheroo

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I can guarantee you that my opinion on Chaisson has nothing to do with groupthink or highlight videos.

I watched literally every snap Chaisson played against Georgia, Oklahoma, Florida, Alabama and Clemson. Every snap of Henderson's against FSU, Georgia, Auburn and LSU.

And it wasn't even these 7 minute cut-up videos on YouTube, the entire games are on there and I went through each of them, except for I think FSU where there was only a condensed version. It's not All-22 unfortunately but for OL/DL you aren't missing too much, and for Henderson I couldn't watch him all the way throughout every single snap but I for damn sure could see the multiple times he got roasted for 40+ yard receptions, including an All-22 view where you can discern the overall coverage.

I can also tell you that that scouts often times don't watch every single game of a prospect, it usually is a sampling of about 5 or so, spread out throughout the season so you aren't watching just games from the beginning/middle/end of the year.

I just got around to watching them seriously now because it's looking like they're the top two options at 17, and of course scouting isn't my job so I don't have basically my entire life to devote to breaking down film.
I always appreciate an informed opinion over a random, unsupported typed thought.
 

Cowboysrock55

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I don't trust that will be the approach, though. It's not like anyone else was going to sign him, so we certainly could've waited until after the draft. I fear this will skew their perception of need and the overall approach, which means a CB in the 1st round.
Would have been the same potential problem if they knew they could have him after the draft.
 

Stasheroo

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Oh I agree completely. Like I said, I loved everything about the guy.
A personal story. I was at an awesome draft party ( a friend holds one every year). With a huge food menu (actually printed up) and an extensive craft beer menu as well. First class all the way. And I remember having a phenomenal time, right up to the point where my stupid favorite team drafted Taco freakin' Charlton over TJ Watt! My night was ruined, and my attitude has suffered as a result ever since. It sucks when you're the guy on deck screaming about that iceberg while nobody listens.

:budd
 

Simpleton

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I always appreciate an informed opinion over a random, unsupported typed thought.
Thanks, like everybody else here I throw out opinions on players I've only watched casually or without a full view of, but of course that's the nature of it. None of us have the time to invest in breaking down 4-5 full games of 50+ prospects, but I will invest the time on some and when I do that's when I'll have my strongest, most fleshed out opinions.

That's where I'm at on Chaisson/Henderson, as well as Kinlaw/Brown.
 

Cowboysrock55

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Thanks, like everybody else here I throw out opinions on players I've only watched casually or without a full view of, but of course that's the nature of it. None of us have the time to invest in breaking down 4-5 full games of 50+ prospects, but I will invest the time on some and when I do that's when I'll have my strongest, most fleshed out opinions.

That's where I'm at on Chaisson/Henderson, as well as Kinlaw/Brown.
Yeah I need to go back and watch Chaisson again. I watched the games live at the time and thought the guy is always around the QB but he wasn't really making the play. But again, I was just enjoying the game and not paying attention to him specifically. I'll have to go back and watch some more.
 

Cowboysrock55

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His biggest problem is alcohol. Keep him away from our frequently drunk owner.
Yeah some people when they drink really can't handle it and go bat shit crazy. That's absolutely the case with this guy. I'm sure all of his legal troubles stem from drinking in one capacity or another.
 

Simpleton

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Yeah I need to go back and watch Chaisson again. I watched the games live at the time and thought the guy is always around the QB but he wasn't really making the play. But again, I was just enjoying the game and not paying attention to him specifically. I'll have to go back and watch some more.
To be fair I think he has a bit of trouble at the top of his rush due to a lack of strength to absorb the contact from the OT and still power all the way through to the QB. He was around the QB a lot, but there were also plenty of "close but not quite there" rushes, even if he had beaten the OT to their edge and even if they did affect the QB.

He also got a few of his sacks as a looper on stunts/twists, which he is actually quite excellent at, but it's not a pure, beating the OT around the corner edge rush.

He's relatively raw as far as his pass rush plan as well, mostly relying on his speed/burst to beat OT's around the corner, although he does flash an effective spin, rip and swipe on occasion. I look at that as a positive though, if he's affecting the QB with a relatively raw repertoire of pass rush counters then there's plenty of room to grow, and given that he got the 18 at LSU his work ethic is definitely top notch to maximize his potential.

All in all, I'm not saying we have to take him at 17 under any circumstances, I'd still prefer trading up for Kinlaw/Brown or down depending on the board, but if it's Chaisson vs. Henderson at 17, give me Chaisson all day, with McKinney after that.
 

Stasheroo

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To be fair I think he has a bit of trouble at the top of his rush due to a lack of strength to absorb the contact from the OT and still power all the way through to the QB. He was around the QB a lot, but there were also plenty of "close but not quite there" rushes, even if he had beaten the OT to their edge and even if they did affect the QB.

He also got a few of his sacks as a looper on stunts/twists, which he is actually quite excellent at, but it's not a pure, beating the OT around the corner edge rush.

He's relatively raw as far as his pass rush plan as well, mostly relying on his speed/burst to beat OT's around the corner, although he does flash an effective spin, rip and swipe on occasion. I look at that as a positive though, if he's affecting the QB with a relatively raw repertoire of pass rush counters then there's plenty of room to grow, and given that he got the 18 at LSU his work ethic is definitely top notch to maximize his potential.

All in all, I'm not saying we have to take him at 17 under any circumstances, I'd still prefer trading up for Kinlaw/Brown or down depending on the board, but if it's Chaisson vs. Henderson at 17, give me Chaisson all day, with McKinney after that.
I agree with your assessments. I think that Chaisson is clearly a player who lacks experience playing football and has only begun to tap into his potential. I keep going back to Danielle Hunter, his LSU predecessor. He was also an attributes guy who had few sacks in college. Far fewer in fact than Chaisson. Teams didn't know what to make of Hunter, the Vikings rolled the dice in round 3, and as a result, they now have one of the league's top pass rushers on a discounted deal.
 
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