Simpleton
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If you don't talk about it it won't happen.
2022 Cowboys Draft Chatter Thread...
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Fuckin’ A.
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Ok, I'll try to block it out as best as I can.
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And the Penning. He will be gone and I they will treat the OT position like they do every other position with a team favorite. No real plan until its too late.
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Simpleton
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Why?
I think there's at least a 40% chance he'll be there and I don't see any reason why the organization would be completely against him. It's certainly possible they prefer to go with a similarly rated prospect at a bigger need position (LG) but I don't think Linderbaum is in the "0% probability" bucket that someone like Penning is in.
Simpleton
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They love Steele and even if they somehow got Penning I bet they'd start him at LG with the plan of having him transition to LT in about 2 years to replace Tyron.
The Steele love may be misguided, I'm cautiously optimistic that he'll be a solid starter, but it's the reality of the situation.
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I believe they are more into replacing the LG versus Biadasz.
Simpleton
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Probably true, I just don't think it's completely impossible like Penning. We're still very Zone-running heavy (could change next year but I doubt it given how Moore has no real experience outside of Garrett-led teams) so I wouldn't be surprised if they loved Linderbaum.
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If they do, they are damn quiet about it. Usually they are pretty obvious if they project the player to be on the board.
Chocolate Lab
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LG might be higher on the priority list, but when Goof Son was asked about Biadasz the other day, he was very non-complimentary IMO. He was fed the usual super softball question about the position and still didn't have much good to say. Makes me think they really don't like him as much as I thought.
shoop
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I think Karlaftis and Penning are gone before us. I don’t think we are taking a C early. G, T, DT, or WR. Yes DT is a pipe dream.
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Cowboys conversation: First-round offensive options that make the most sense for Dallas
By Jon Machota 48m ago
Last week at the NFL’s owners’ meetings in Florida, Jerry Jones addressed the state of the Cowboys current roster. While he acknowledged it doesn’t look better on paper than it did at the end of last season, Jones pointed out that there are still important moves to be made, particularly during this month’s NFL draft.
“This time last year, we didn’t have Micah Parsons,” Jones said. “I like where we are right now as well as I did at this time last year.”
Since Jones mentioned Parsons, the NFL’s Defensive Rookie of the Year who the Cowboys selected with the 12th overall pick last year, The Athletic’s Jon Machota and Bob Sturm decided to have a couple of discussions about the possibilities for Dallas with its first-round pick this year. To break it up into two parts, Machota and Sturm begin with the offensive possibilities in this piece and will circle back to the defensive possibilities next week.
Machota: This week the Cowboys are scheduled to meet with many of their 30 official pre-draft visitors at The Star. Over the past 15-plus years, many of those visitors have ended up being drafted by Dallas. Last week, I tweeted out a list of the nine Cowboys’ pre-draft visitors who are first-round possibilities. Seven are offensive players. Wide receivers Drake London (USC), Treylon Burks (Arkansas), and Chris Olave (Ohio State) and offensive linemen Charles Cross (Mississippi State), Bernhard Raimann (Central Michigan), Kenyon Green (Texas A&M) and Zion Johnson (Boston College). Any of those stand out to you?
Sturm: Yeah. I think you start out with the conversations about what type of player they are looking for there. I think it opens up a great conversation because there are a number of ways to address your offseason, but your 24th pick will absolutely be your biggest asset. You weren’t ever going to spend $30 million on a player externally in free agency, so your first draft pick is your best chance to add a really key player to this thing. A lot of those players catch my eye. If you walked away with any of those names, I think you would feel pretty solid about things. But it kind of introduces a bigger conversation and that’s if you’re running this team, what’s the best way to get better fast at Pick 24? What are your thoughts on that?
Machota: For me, I’m leaning toward taking one of those offensive linemen. I think there’s a good chance they’re going to have multiple options from that group, and I thought the most disappointing aspect of the team last year was the offensive line. Connor Williams probably wasn’t the answer at left guard, but he went to the Dolphins in free agency anyway, so that position has to still be addressed. So when I see Kenyon Green and Zion Johnson, I see two potential options to upgrade that starting position at left guard. And I feel that you can get good wide receivers in the second and third round. I feel better about the options at wide receiver in those rounds than I do about immediately fixing the issue at left guard. They have CeeDee Lamb and Michael Gallup already at wide receiver. They need another, but it doesn’t necessarily have to be a first-round pick. Now, going off the way the team has drafted the last two years, particularly in the first round, since Mike McCarthy has become head coach, any of those nine visitors is realistically in play at 24.
Sturm: I do want to enter one thing in the conversation that I think is relevant here. How much say does Mike McCarthy have on this decision at Pick 24? Do you feel like they’re terribly interested in his thoughts on these matters? Or is he in danger of being a lame duck?
Machota: I think he has a say in the decision. The Cowboys have allowed their coaching staffs to be a part of the process for a while and I don’t expect that to change with this draft. And I think McCarthy should have a say. You can argue that the way they’ve drafted the last two years, particularly in the first round, has been the best thing that’s happened since McCarthy has been hired. They went away from their original plan each of the last two years in the first round and they ended up with Lamb and Parsons, two Pro-Bowl cornerstone pieces on this roster. The way the Packers drafted when McCarthy was head coach is different than how the Cowboys drafted while Jason Garrett was head coach. Why not have another voice in the room that may see things from a little different perspective? And because they’ve drafted differently the last couple of years, it really makes things interesting this year at 24. No one really knows what the plan is for sure at this point.
Sturm: Well, I was leading the witness with that question, because the thing I think doesn’t get talked about enough is where McCarthy sees value in the offensive line. I feel like I’ve said this in passing a few times, but let’s actually put specifics to it. I took one of McCarthy’s best teams, the 2016 Packers, who went to the NFC title game. I just wanted to go look at their offensive line to give you an idea of whether or not McCarthy thinks you need a first-round pick at each offensive line position. You probably know the answer, but let’s look at some detail for people.
Bryan Bulaga was his tackle at Pick 23, the right tackle. Absolutely fine player. He wasn’t good as the left tackle, and that was David Bakhtiari, who is still their left tackle. He was Pick 109 in the fourth round. Then their guards that year were Lane Taylor from Oklahoma State, who was an undrafted free agent, and T.J. Lang, who was No. 109 from Eastern Michigan, so also a fourth-round pick. And they had a platoon at center. One is now the highest-paid center in the NFL (Corey Linsley) with the Chargers. He was Pick 161 in the fifth round. And then J.C. Tretter, who is the head of the NFL Players Association and has been the Browns center for a while and is currently a free agent. He was Pick 122 of the fourth round. So they had six offensive linemen play most of their snaps on one of his best teams and only one was picked in the first 100 picks.
That tells me McCarthy understands that the filet mignon on the offensive line is not necessarily required or his cup of tea. I know that’s not how the Jones family feels because it feels like every time the Cowboys need an offensive lineman, everyone wants a top-20 pick used on one of these guys. Even if it’s a guard or a center they want a first-rounder used on these guys, which I don’t think is how the rest of the NFL believes this works. I think the Cowboys are one of the rare teams that believe you have to find, especially interior offensive line, on Day 1 of the draft.
Machota: I think that just goes with the front office listening to their head coach. Jason Garrett believed in building the team through a talented offensive line and strong running game. Whether you’re talking about Tyron Smith, the first draft pick of the Garrett era, Travis Frederick or Zack Martin getting picked in the first round or drafting Ezekiel Elliott fourth overall and then making him the highest-paid running back, I don’t think those things happen if McCarthy was the coach at that time. But that’s the way Garrett wanted the team constructed. Because there’s a different coaching staff, we’re seeing changes in the way the team is being constructed.
I’m glad you pointed out all the success Green Bay has had finding these standout offensive linemen in the middle or later rounds, because they are outstanding in that area. But McCarthy’s Packers also went back-to-back first-round offensive linemen in 2010 and 2011 with Bulaga and Derek Sherrod, so obviously they still invested there. I just think it changes for the Cowboys with who the head coach is and what their blueprint is for building the roster. It’ll be interesting to see how Terence Steele’s career ends up because they might’ve found their starting right tackle for the better part of the next decade via an undrafted rookie free agent. I’m not saying they have to take an offensive lineman at 24, I just think of what might be there, addressing the offensive line issues makes a lot of sense.
Sturm: I think you’re absolutely right. I think that’s a very solid thought process. Do you think they are interested in a wide receiver in the first round?
Machota: Yes, absolutely. In talking to McCarthy over the last couple of years, it’s easy to understand that he really wants several good wide receivers because of how good teams defend your top wide receivers in big games. They can do things to take a couple of your top perimeter players away, or at least limit them. So it often comes down to the production you get out of your third and fourth receivers because they’re going to be in much more favorable matchups. So you look at the current roster and there’s Lamb and Gallup and James Washington, but they still need another starting wide receiver to make up for the loss of Amari Cooper.
Sturm: Taking a wide receiver at 24 would really address a situation here. I guess the question is: What type of receiver are they looking for? Because there are a lot of first-round receivers and each seems to be very different from the others. Olave seems like a tremendous route runner but he’s also very undersized. So are you kind of looking for a guy who can do so many things for you around the field, but if they’ve had a premium on wanting to make sure they got guys who can go block safeties in the run game, he might not be their cup of tea, but also his yards after catch are sort of limited but he can definitely take the top off a defense. Whereas a guy like Burks, I see a Deebo Samuel type. My question is are the Cowboys and Kellen Moore prepared to use a wide receiver like Samuel? That required an awful lot of creativity and vision from Kyle Shanahan and Mike McDaniel. I’m curious if that suits the Cowboys’ way of looking at offense right now under Moore.
Machota: I’m so glad that you brought that up because there are obvious connections with the Jones family and Arkansas football. Jerry Jones and Stephen Jones played football at Arkansas. Stephen’s son, John Stephen Jones, has been a reserve quarterback at Arkansas the past four years. So I’m sure if any team knows Treylon Burks, it has to be the Cowboys. I’ve thought many times while looking at mock drafts projecting Burks to Dallas about how it will be sold to us, if he is the Cowboys’ pick, about how this is a Deebo Samuel-type player. And about how the 49ers just knocked the Cowboys out of the playoffs and how they now have their Deebo to use in a variety of ways. It just seems like the type of publicity that Jerry Jones would love. But are they going to use him in a similar way? If he’s the pick, they’ll certainly say they are, but we really won’t know until we see it on the field. The other thing with McCarthy is he’s big on all of his wide receivers being able to line up in multiple spots on the outside and in the slot.
Sturm: The other thing as you start going down these players is just making sure that you’re not caught up as a prisoner of the moment. When I say that, the Amari Cooper hole and the Connor Williams hole might make you make a shortsighted band-aid when in reality, you should make sure that you’re selecting players based on the five-year trajectory of a first-round contract. A lot of times teams are held captive by that outcry that they have to address these two situations. Maybe the Randy Gregory one is similar in applying pressure. And we’ll certainly address that next week when we talk about the defense.
But let’s wrap up by circling back to the visitor list of 30 names and the offensive linemen on it — Johnson, Green, Cross and Raimann. I still have to give a day to Raimann, so let’s table him until I have had a chance to really look him over and just discuss Green and Johnson a bit. I really think from what I’ve seen, Green looks exactly like the type of player that the Cowboys would enjoy. He has good versatility, but more than anything, he is a very strong man who has really exhibited the ability to handle his business at a very high level, so I really like that. They moved him around a lot this season, but if he gets to 24, I am totally fine with jumping on the table and saying this is our guy. There’s a lot to like with Johnson, too. Look, all these guys at 24 are fantastic players. There is a slight issue I had with him that would put him behind Green in terms of just general recognition and awareness, but that can be cleaned up, especially if you’re well-coached by an offensive line coach. I like both of those players quite a bit. I think Cross might not get to 24, but I suppose you should remain ready. If Charles Cross is there at 24, we can certainly boogie there as well. I do like those names on the offensive line and I think each would be pretty tempting if they get to you there.
Machota: It seems like there’s a decent chance that Green or Johnson should be there for them at 24. The Athletic’s Bruce Feldman put out an interesting mock draft on Monday that I think everyone should check out. It includes comments from several college coaches on each prospect. For example, one coach on Green: “He was a pretty good tackle, but he’s an outstanding guard. I don’t think his feet
are good enough to play tackle at a high level, but he’s powerful, is very good with his hands and is a road-grader in the run game.”
Cowboys offensive line coach Joe Philbin also attended Texas A&M’s pro day to obviously watch Green. It just seems like there’s a lot of interest there.
Sturm: Well, that’s a big part of the decision-making process, and of course, the other part of it is what do the teams in front of you do to cooperate. In recent years, the Cowboys have had situations smile upon them, but at 24 you’re definitely at the mercy of a lot of other teams and many of those other teams have already said they need wide receivers bad, so this will be interesting.
By Jon Machota 48m ago
Last week at the NFL’s owners’ meetings in Florida, Jerry Jones addressed the state of the Cowboys current roster. While he acknowledged it doesn’t look better on paper than it did at the end of last season, Jones pointed out that there are still important moves to be made, particularly during this month’s NFL draft.
“This time last year, we didn’t have Micah Parsons,” Jones said. “I like where we are right now as well as I did at this time last year.”
Since Jones mentioned Parsons, the NFL’s Defensive Rookie of the Year who the Cowboys selected with the 12th overall pick last year, The Athletic’s Jon Machota and Bob Sturm decided to have a couple of discussions about the possibilities for Dallas with its first-round pick this year. To break it up into two parts, Machota and Sturm begin with the offensive possibilities in this piece and will circle back to the defensive possibilities next week.
Machota: This week the Cowboys are scheduled to meet with many of their 30 official pre-draft visitors at The Star. Over the past 15-plus years, many of those visitors have ended up being drafted by Dallas. Last week, I tweeted out a list of the nine Cowboys’ pre-draft visitors who are first-round possibilities. Seven are offensive players. Wide receivers Drake London (USC), Treylon Burks (Arkansas), and Chris Olave (Ohio State) and offensive linemen Charles Cross (Mississippi State), Bernhard Raimann (Central Michigan), Kenyon Green (Texas A&M) and Zion Johnson (Boston College). Any of those stand out to you?
Sturm: Yeah. I think you start out with the conversations about what type of player they are looking for there. I think it opens up a great conversation because there are a number of ways to address your offseason, but your 24th pick will absolutely be your biggest asset. You weren’t ever going to spend $30 million on a player externally in free agency, so your first draft pick is your best chance to add a really key player to this thing. A lot of those players catch my eye. If you walked away with any of those names, I think you would feel pretty solid about things. But it kind of introduces a bigger conversation and that’s if you’re running this team, what’s the best way to get better fast at Pick 24? What are your thoughts on that?
Machota: For me, I’m leaning toward taking one of those offensive linemen. I think there’s a good chance they’re going to have multiple options from that group, and I thought the most disappointing aspect of the team last year was the offensive line. Connor Williams probably wasn’t the answer at left guard, but he went to the Dolphins in free agency anyway, so that position has to still be addressed. So when I see Kenyon Green and Zion Johnson, I see two potential options to upgrade that starting position at left guard. And I feel that you can get good wide receivers in the second and third round. I feel better about the options at wide receiver in those rounds than I do about immediately fixing the issue at left guard. They have CeeDee Lamb and Michael Gallup already at wide receiver. They need another, but it doesn’t necessarily have to be a first-round pick. Now, going off the way the team has drafted the last two years, particularly in the first round, since Mike McCarthy has become head coach, any of those nine visitors is realistically in play at 24.
Sturm: I do want to enter one thing in the conversation that I think is relevant here. How much say does Mike McCarthy have on this decision at Pick 24? Do you feel like they’re terribly interested in his thoughts on these matters? Or is he in danger of being a lame duck?
Machota: I think he has a say in the decision. The Cowboys have allowed their coaching staffs to be a part of the process for a while and I don’t expect that to change with this draft. And I think McCarthy should have a say. You can argue that the way they’ve drafted the last two years, particularly in the first round, has been the best thing that’s happened since McCarthy has been hired. They went away from their original plan each of the last two years in the first round and they ended up with Lamb and Parsons, two Pro-Bowl cornerstone pieces on this roster. The way the Packers drafted when McCarthy was head coach is different than how the Cowboys drafted while Jason Garrett was head coach. Why not have another voice in the room that may see things from a little different perspective? And because they’ve drafted differently the last couple of years, it really makes things interesting this year at 24. No one really knows what the plan is for sure at this point.
Sturm: Well, I was leading the witness with that question, because the thing I think doesn’t get talked about enough is where McCarthy sees value in the offensive line. I feel like I’ve said this in passing a few times, but let’s actually put specifics to it. I took one of McCarthy’s best teams, the 2016 Packers, who went to the NFC title game. I just wanted to go look at their offensive line to give you an idea of whether or not McCarthy thinks you need a first-round pick at each offensive line position. You probably know the answer, but let’s look at some detail for people.
Bryan Bulaga was his tackle at Pick 23, the right tackle. Absolutely fine player. He wasn’t good as the left tackle, and that was David Bakhtiari, who is still their left tackle. He was Pick 109 in the fourth round. Then their guards that year were Lane Taylor from Oklahoma State, who was an undrafted free agent, and T.J. Lang, who was No. 109 from Eastern Michigan, so also a fourth-round pick. And they had a platoon at center. One is now the highest-paid center in the NFL (Corey Linsley) with the Chargers. He was Pick 161 in the fifth round. And then J.C. Tretter, who is the head of the NFL Players Association and has been the Browns center for a while and is currently a free agent. He was Pick 122 of the fourth round. So they had six offensive linemen play most of their snaps on one of his best teams and only one was picked in the first 100 picks.
That tells me McCarthy understands that the filet mignon on the offensive line is not necessarily required or his cup of tea. I know that’s not how the Jones family feels because it feels like every time the Cowboys need an offensive lineman, everyone wants a top-20 pick used on one of these guys. Even if it’s a guard or a center they want a first-rounder used on these guys, which I don’t think is how the rest of the NFL believes this works. I think the Cowboys are one of the rare teams that believe you have to find, especially interior offensive line, on Day 1 of the draft.
Machota: I think that just goes with the front office listening to their head coach. Jason Garrett believed in building the team through a talented offensive line and strong running game. Whether you’re talking about Tyron Smith, the first draft pick of the Garrett era, Travis Frederick or Zack Martin getting picked in the first round or drafting Ezekiel Elliott fourth overall and then making him the highest-paid running back, I don’t think those things happen if McCarthy was the coach at that time. But that’s the way Garrett wanted the team constructed. Because there’s a different coaching staff, we’re seeing changes in the way the team is being constructed.
I’m glad you pointed out all the success Green Bay has had finding these standout offensive linemen in the middle or later rounds, because they are outstanding in that area. But McCarthy’s Packers also went back-to-back first-round offensive linemen in 2010 and 2011 with Bulaga and Derek Sherrod, so obviously they still invested there. I just think it changes for the Cowboys with who the head coach is and what their blueprint is for building the roster. It’ll be interesting to see how Terence Steele’s career ends up because they might’ve found their starting right tackle for the better part of the next decade via an undrafted rookie free agent. I’m not saying they have to take an offensive lineman at 24, I just think of what might be there, addressing the offensive line issues makes a lot of sense.
Sturm: I think you’re absolutely right. I think that’s a very solid thought process. Do you think they are interested in a wide receiver in the first round?
Machota: Yes, absolutely. In talking to McCarthy over the last couple of years, it’s easy to understand that he really wants several good wide receivers because of how good teams defend your top wide receivers in big games. They can do things to take a couple of your top perimeter players away, or at least limit them. So it often comes down to the production you get out of your third and fourth receivers because they’re going to be in much more favorable matchups. So you look at the current roster and there’s Lamb and Gallup and James Washington, but they still need another starting wide receiver to make up for the loss of Amari Cooper.
Sturm: Taking a wide receiver at 24 would really address a situation here. I guess the question is: What type of receiver are they looking for? Because there are a lot of first-round receivers and each seems to be very different from the others. Olave seems like a tremendous route runner but he’s also very undersized. So are you kind of looking for a guy who can do so many things for you around the field, but if they’ve had a premium on wanting to make sure they got guys who can go block safeties in the run game, he might not be their cup of tea, but also his yards after catch are sort of limited but he can definitely take the top off a defense. Whereas a guy like Burks, I see a Deebo Samuel type. My question is are the Cowboys and Kellen Moore prepared to use a wide receiver like Samuel? That required an awful lot of creativity and vision from Kyle Shanahan and Mike McDaniel. I’m curious if that suits the Cowboys’ way of looking at offense right now under Moore.
Machota: I’m so glad that you brought that up because there are obvious connections with the Jones family and Arkansas football. Jerry Jones and Stephen Jones played football at Arkansas. Stephen’s son, John Stephen Jones, has been a reserve quarterback at Arkansas the past four years. So I’m sure if any team knows Treylon Burks, it has to be the Cowboys. I’ve thought many times while looking at mock drafts projecting Burks to Dallas about how it will be sold to us, if he is the Cowboys’ pick, about how this is a Deebo Samuel-type player. And about how the 49ers just knocked the Cowboys out of the playoffs and how they now have their Deebo to use in a variety of ways. It just seems like the type of publicity that Jerry Jones would love. But are they going to use him in a similar way? If he’s the pick, they’ll certainly say they are, but we really won’t know until we see it on the field. The other thing with McCarthy is he’s big on all of his wide receivers being able to line up in multiple spots on the outside and in the slot.
Sturm: The other thing as you start going down these players is just making sure that you’re not caught up as a prisoner of the moment. When I say that, the Amari Cooper hole and the Connor Williams hole might make you make a shortsighted band-aid when in reality, you should make sure that you’re selecting players based on the five-year trajectory of a first-round contract. A lot of times teams are held captive by that outcry that they have to address these two situations. Maybe the Randy Gregory one is similar in applying pressure. And we’ll certainly address that next week when we talk about the defense.
But let’s wrap up by circling back to the visitor list of 30 names and the offensive linemen on it — Johnson, Green, Cross and Raimann. I still have to give a day to Raimann, so let’s table him until I have had a chance to really look him over and just discuss Green and Johnson a bit. I really think from what I’ve seen, Green looks exactly like the type of player that the Cowboys would enjoy. He has good versatility, but more than anything, he is a very strong man who has really exhibited the ability to handle his business at a very high level, so I really like that. They moved him around a lot this season, but if he gets to 24, I am totally fine with jumping on the table and saying this is our guy. There’s a lot to like with Johnson, too. Look, all these guys at 24 are fantastic players. There is a slight issue I had with him that would put him behind Green in terms of just general recognition and awareness, but that can be cleaned up, especially if you’re well-coached by an offensive line coach. I like both of those players quite a bit. I think Cross might not get to 24, but I suppose you should remain ready. If Charles Cross is there at 24, we can certainly boogie there as well. I do like those names on the offensive line and I think each would be pretty tempting if they get to you there.
Machota: It seems like there’s a decent chance that Green or Johnson should be there for them at 24. The Athletic’s Bruce Feldman put out an interesting mock draft on Monday that I think everyone should check out. It includes comments from several college coaches on each prospect. For example, one coach on Green: “He was a pretty good tackle, but he’s an outstanding guard. I don’t think his feet
are good enough to play tackle at a high level, but he’s powerful, is very good with his hands and is a road-grader in the run game.”
Cowboys offensive line coach Joe Philbin also attended Texas A&M’s pro day to obviously watch Green. It just seems like there’s a lot of interest there.
Sturm: Well, that’s a big part of the decision-making process, and of course, the other part of it is what do the teams in front of you do to cooperate. In recent years, the Cowboys have had situations smile upon them, but at 24 you’re definitely at the mercy of a lot of other teams and many of those other teams have already said they need wide receivers bad, so this will be interesting.
Simpleton
DCC 4Life
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If Green is there I think he's the pick given that he's a ready-made LG and can credibly play 3-4 different spots. I feel similarly about Johnson but not quite as strongly.
I think we'd take someone like Olave over Johnson, but probably not Green.
The real question to me is what happens if the board comes down to Johnson vs. Burks vs. a defensive player like Dean.
I think we'd take someone like Olave over Johnson, but probably not Green.
The real question to me is what happens if the board comes down to Johnson vs. Burks vs. a defensive player like Dean.
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I think they straight up want another guy to compete and or backup Biadasz. But I don't think they view him as a guy they are actively trying to replace. You can tell that from the centers we did bring in for a visit. To me those are fourth round on type guys. Although I know some have the Nebraska kid earlier.
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