2021 Season | Divisional Weekend | Gameday Chatter Thread | 1/22/22-1/23/22

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Looking at both ANY/A and QB Ratings together, some overall observations:

Overrated QBs
a. Staubach is essentially lowest for ANY/A and QB Rating, yet highest number of Championship Games (sans Brady). Even if you argued that it's unfair to compare Staubach to today's pass-friendly era, Staubach is still way lower than Bart Starr, Terry Bradshaw, Ken Stabler.
b. See Dan Marino below

Underrated QBs
a. Joe Flacco, man. Gamer in the playoffs, up there in the Top 10 for both ANY/A and QB Rating
b. Kurt Warner doesn't get enough cred, often shit on as the worst of HOF QBs, but he's your Top 3 playoff QB with Bart Starr and Mahomes
c. Troy Aikman also gets shit on as worst of HOF QBs, but he's just a playoff Gamer. While these stats don't show it, just being a Cowboys fan, you know Aikman probably has the largest delta in stats from his prime (1992-1995) to past prime. Just looking at Aikman's prime (11 games), his ANY/A is 7.97 (which ranks #1) and QB Rating is 106.3 (also ranks #1), so his past prime games (4 games) really lower his overall stats. Obviously, he's a HOFer for what he did in 1992-1995.
d. Weird to put Joe Montana in Underrated QB, but all this talk about Tom Brady being the Greatest of All Time, you have to remind folks of Montana's dominance. What if Joe Montana played in a QB-friendly era of today, enabling a healthy Montana 1990-1997 that stays with Jerry Rice in San Francisco? If Steve Young could do what he did from 1992 - 1997 (4 NFCC appearances), Montana might have won all of the Cowboys Super Bowl rings and more - 1990, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1997?
e. Russell Wilson quietly putting up Top 10 stats. If Seahawks able to gut out one more SB appearance, Russell Wilson may enter Top 10 QB discussions. These stats don't include his rushing, either (527 yards, 3TD).

One SB appearance QBs...
a. Aaron Rodgers, even though only with one Super Bowl ring, is doing his part in the playoffs, ranking Top 5 in both ANY/A and QB rating
b. Alternatively to Rodgers, Dan Marino, who's frequently cited as Top 5 QB all-time, Dan Marino ranks in the bottom 5 in both categories.
c. Drew Brees ranks Top 10 in both categories, but famously knocked out of playoffs twice due to last second miracles, or else could have (should have) three SB appearances.

 

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I can’t stand Rodgers, but outside of him having Adams and an older Nelson as his go to WR, he hasn’t had a dynamic cast around him since the mid-2000’s outside of the SB season. Adams, Driver, and Nelson? He had Jennings, Driver, Nelson and Finley when he won his SB I believe.

It's plausible that Aaron Rodgers should have 2 Super Bowl appearances and maybe 3. Obviously, you can counter that Rodgers didn't do enough in the first 3 quarters to prevent the below situation from occurring...However, looking at Aaron Rodgers' Top 5 Playoff stats above, it's not like Rodgers is a King of Regular Season and then chokes and goes fetal position in playoffs.

2014 NFCC vs Seahawks - Richard Rodgers catches that onside kick and Packers are in the Super Bowl
2020 NFCC vs Buccaneers - Still one of the worst end-of-game decisions I've seen, LaFleur decides to kick FG on 4th Goal while trailing Bucs. Of course, not guaranteed that Aaron Rodgers gets the go-ahead TD (or Brady doesn't have his own comeback), but Rodgers didn't even get that chance. We'll never know.

 

[p1_]

Also take with grain of salt, but highest all-time career playoff QB Rating (min 10 games). Interesting how this list has many QBs you wouldn't even consider Hall of Famers

#1 -#10
105.7, Mahomes
104.8, Bart Starr
102.8, Kurt Warner
100.8, Matt Ryan
100.1, Aaron Rodgers
97.1, Drew Brees
95.6, Joe Montana
95.3, Russell Wilson
90.4, Tom Brady
88.6, Joe Flacco

Rank #11 - 20
88.3, Troy Aikman
87.4, Eli Manning & Peyton Manning
86.7, Roethlisberger
86.3, Brett Favre
85.8, Steve Young
85.3, Philip Rivers
84.9, Warren Moon
84.2, Ken Stabler
83.0, Terry Bradshaw

Rank #20 - 26
80.0, Donovan McNabb
79.7, John Elway
77.1, Dan Marino
77.0, Phil Simms
76.0, Roger Staubach
72.3, Jim Kelly

as long as youre throwing out grains of salt, consider postseason records and winning percentage. Those are pretty telling statistics for QBs.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Brings up an interesting topic of discussion. The Patriots and Tom Brady have changed perceptions, but is having one Super Bowl a disappointment for all-time great QBs that excludes a QB from the top tier?

Rodgers is an interesting case because he doesn’t even have a second SB appearance, just like Brees and Marino.

Sports radio was already talking about Mahomes and the Chiefs being a disappointment with only one SB ring. Question was asked what happens if Mahomes never returns to the Super Bowl and the guy answers ‘he’d be Aaron Rodgers’ like it was a bad thing.

Maybe I’m a Rodgers-homer, but critiquing his one SB ring seems over critical. I don’t think he’s had as great a surrounding cast as other all-time greats. Not to go all @L.T. Fan on you all, but winning a SB is much more of a team effort.

Agree, I think he's one of the best I've ever seen. Not sure of the number exactly, but probably top 5-6 at least.

Still think Marino was greatness also, zero rings or not.

 

[ravidubey]

Sports radio was already talking about Mahomes and the Chiefs being a disappointment with only one SB ring

Brady and Belichick have ruined people

Tom Brady 7/10, 22 years
Troy Aikman 3/3, 12 years
Ben Roethlisberger 2/3, 18 years
Peyton Manning 2/3, 17 years
Kurt Warner 1/3, 13 years
Mahomes 1/2, 5 years
Wilson 1/2, 10 years
Rodgers 1/1, 17 years
Brees 1/1, 20 years

Just getting to the Superbowl is god damned hard and winning it is a minor miracle. I mean, this random selection of QBs is unbelievable company for a 26 year old kid.

 

[p1_]

Brady and Belichick have ruined people

Tom Brady 7/10, 22 years
Troy Aikman 3/3, 12 years
Rodgers 1/1, 17 years
Brees 1/1, 20 years

very interesting how Aikman is the nearest to Brady and the only perfect record of any who played more than one SB.

 

[ravidubey]

very interesting how Aikman is the nearest to Brady and the only perfect record of any who played more than one SB.

Sorry, my bad, I didn't list everyone just the ones that occurred to me. Montana and Bradshaw are each 4/4 and Eli is 2/2

 

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as long as youre throwing out grains of salt, consider postseason records and winning percentage. Those are pretty telling statistics for QBs.

Brady and Belichick have ruined people

Tom Brady 7/10, 22 years
Troy Aikman 3/3, 12 years
Ben Roethlisberger 2/3, 18 years
Peyton Manning 2/3, 17 years
Kurt Warner 1/3, 13 years
Mahomes 1/2, 5 years
Wilson 1/2, 10 years
Rodgers 1/1, 17 years
Brees 1/1, 20 years

Just getting to the Superbowl is god damned hard and winning it is a minor miracle. I mean, this random selection of QBs is unbelievable company for a 26 year old kid.

the next connection to make is the QBs performance compared to the game’s W/L result.

If there’s a QB with poor passing stats but great W-L record, they may not be as valuable as another QB with worse W-L record but better passing stats.

 

[p1_]

Sorry, my bad, I didn't list everyone just the ones that occurred to me. Montana and Bradshaw are each 4/4 and Eli is 2/2

the perfect W/L record for multiple SBs is exclusive company.

 

[ravidubey]

the perfect W/L record for multiple SBs is exclusive company.

Yep, some great teams in there, Eli’s Giants not included of course

 

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Yep, some great teams in there, Eli’s Giants not included of course

Unbelievable. Still one of life’s greatest mysteries.

Was it a weak playoff schedule? Extreme luck? Just getting hot at the right time?

The 2007 Giants finished the regular season 2-2 in December or 4-4 their last eight games, so not exactly a team getting hot.

While their wild card opponent was a weak 9-7 Buccaneers led by Jeff Garcia, they beat a healthy Cowboys and Packers, both on the road. Of course, they beat a healthy 16-0 Patriots.

The Giants held the high-flying offenses Of Cowboys, Packers and Patriots to an average 17 points, but their last 3 regular season games averaged 26 points given up.

Had the Giants stayed with giving up 26 points per game, they would’ve lost each of their four playoff games because their offense never score more than 24. In the three games vs Cowboys, Packers, Patriots, the Giants only rushed for more than 100 yards once and never did Eli pass for more than 300 yards. In fact, against the Cowboys Eli Manning had 12 completions for 182 yards and RBs combined for 88 yards rushing.

Unbelievable…

…Then, there’s the Nick Foles Story. I swear the devil is doing this with our division rivals just to fuck with Jerruh. 2022 is gonna have the Commanders hoisting the SB trophy with interim head coach Jason Garrett and MVP Jaylon Smith who recorded two sacks and a pick six.

 

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All-time Super Bowl QB rankings: Where do Matthew Stafford and Joe Burrow slot in?

Gregg Rosenthal provides a pecking order for the 65 starting quarterbacks in the history of the Super Bowl. Where do Matthew Stafford and Joe Burrow rank on this list of esteemed passers?

www.nfl.com