Minicamp/OTAs Thread...

L.T. Fan

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Small school players are in small schools for a reason. The large established programs glean the cream of the crop for their programs. Of course you can always identify a few that became stand outs or made the grade but those are the exceptions. Remember that when you are trying to make a case for them. The rule is the bigger and better the program the bigger and better chance for a good player.
 

Jiggyfly

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Small school players are in small schools for a reason. The large established programs glean the cream of the crop for their programs. Of course you can always identify a few that became stand outs or made the grade but those are the exceptions. Remember that when you are trying to make a case for them. The rule is the bigger and better the program the bigger and better chance for a good player.
Remember also that sometimes small school players were overlooked or develope later and better than big school guys.

The player should always be judged on there own merits its sounds like you think a small school guy should have an asterick or something.

And this really has no bearing because UConn is not a small school, a second tier football program but they play legitimate competition.
 
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Cowboysrock55

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Small school players are in small schools for a reason. The large established programs glean the cream of the crop for their programs. Of course you can always identify a few that became stand outs or made the grade but those are the exceptions. Remember that when you are trying to make a case for them. The rule is the bigger and better the program the bigger and better chance for a good player.
That sounds great in theory but the problem is some of these players from top programs tend to be busts because they are a bit of a product of their surroundings. A CB recruit goes to Alabama and plays with one of the best front 7's in college football and looks like a really good player. The problem is that pass rush and scheme were covering up some very strong deficiencies. On the other hand a player goes to Vanderbilt and looks like a stud, you at least know it's not likely a product of the front 7 or a superior scheme. So in a way it's easier to evaluate a player on a lower level school.

You also have to keep in mind that high school recruiting rankings are horribly inaccurate and you're dealing with 18 year old unfinished products. While generally the more talented guys will go to Alabama instead of say Iowa there is a reason why Iowa for example still produces better OT's consistently. There is just so much physical development that takes place during a players college career.
 

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Remember also that sometimes small school players were overlooked or develope later and better than big school guys.

The player should always be judged on there own merits its sounds like you think a small school guy should have an asterick or something.

And this really has no bearing because UConn is not a small school, a second tier football program but they play legitimate competition.
Fine judge a player on his merits. My premise is that the majority of good prospects will be in big schools with good programs. I have already stated there are exceptions.
 

L.T. Fan

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That sounds great in theory but the problem is some of these players from top programs tend to be busts because they are a bit of a product of their surroundings. A CB recruit goes to Alabama and plays with one of the best front 7's in college football and looks like a really good player. The problem is that pass rush and scheme were covering up some very strong deficiencies. On the other hand a player goes to Vanderbilt and looks like a stud, you at least know it's not likely a product of the front 7 or a superior scheme. So in a way it's easier to evaluate a player on a lower level school.

You also have to keep in mind that high school recruiting rankings are horribly inaccurate and you're dealing with 18 year old unfinished products. While generally the more talented guys will go to Alabama instead of say Iowa there is a reason why Iowa for example still produces better OT's consistently. There is just so much physical development that takes place during a players college career.
All of that is potentially correct but statistically the majority of players that are drafted and make it in the pros come from big schools with established programs. I indicated .there are exceptions.
 

Cowboysrock55

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All of that is potentially correct but statistically the majority of players that are drafted and make it in the pros come from big schools wiestablished programs. I indicated .there are exceptions.
I get what you're saying but if you look at a school like Alabama who continually brings in the best recruits in the country, I think the argument could be made that they produce an awful lot of draft busts. Maybe the most draft busts in the NFL (If not LSU or one of these other power schools).

My preference is always to draft a player from one of the major conferences though. These DII players for example are really difficult to judge because there level of competition is just so low that even a mild talent could look like a stud. I don
t know what your definition of "big schools" is though. Like I pointed out, I'd feel a hell of a lot better with an OT out of Iowa then Alabama even though Alabama gets better recruits.
 

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Allow me to clarify big schools. Division 1.
 

L.T. Fan

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I get what you're saying but if you look at a school like Alabama who continually brings in the best recruits in the country, I think the argument could be made that they produce an awful lot of draft busts. Maybe the most draft busts in the NFL (If not LSU or one of these other power schools).

My preference is always to draft a player from one of the major conferences though. These DII players for example are really difficult to judge because there level of competition is just so low that even a mild talent could look like a stud. I don
t know what your definition of "big schools" is though. Like I pointed out, I'd feel a hell of a lot better with an OT out of Iowa then Alabama even though Alabama gets better recruits.
I think you are still making a case from the exceptions side.
 

Jiggyfly

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Fine judge a player on his merits. My premise is that the majority of good prospects will be in big schools with good programs. I have already stated there are exceptions.
So your post really had nothing to do with the topic just random thoughts on big schools?
 

L.T. Fan

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So your post really had nothing to do with the topic just random thoughts on big schools?
It had to do with Townsend's post about small school players. Do you deliberately try to adgitate or it it you just don't read?
 

boozeman

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Scout’s Eye: Possible Position Switches To Keep In Mind During Week 3 Of OTAs


Monday, June 08, 2015 4:45 PM CDT

By Bryan Broaddus


Football Analyst/Scout



@BryanBroaddus

IRVING, Texas – Some more notes on what I’ll be watching for this week, as the Cowboys get underway in their third week of OTA practices. Cowboys coach Jason Garrett said last week that he doesn’t like to use the term “experiment” when moving players around these offensive and defensive schemes. That said, this is the perfect time of year for the coaching staff to see what all they have from their personnel.

•I will be interested to see this coming week how many times we see the ball go in the direction of Devin Street with Tony Romo on the field. With no Dez Bryant and Romo’s familiarity with what he has in Terrence Williams -- will there be a connection between him and the second-year receiver? All we have heard this offseason is that Street could be just as good as Williams if given the opportunity. The key will be whether Street can earn that trust from Romo like the other receivers have on this squad. Street is going to have to prove that he can run all the routes, either between the 20's or more importantly in the red zone, where Williams has been super productive. Street has the size and skill to win on his routes consistently, but if he is not able to finish, then that’s another story. We have seen over the years that if Romo has faith in a receiver, he will find a way to get them the ball. Street needs to start to earn that trust.

•In my previous article Monday morning for DallasCowboys.com, I wrote about the various combinations we are seeing in the secondary. I made a mention of where they have been playing Byron Jones on both sides and in the slot. I believe there is going to be a time where we see Jones playing as a free safety in this scheme. I thought it would have been during training camp, but after last week's action covering Jason Witten out of the middle field and the fact that these defensive coaches have thrown a great deal on his plate and he has responded well, we could see him get some snaps there more likely sooner than later. I thought that these coaches would just ease Jones in and let him learn as he goes but that’s not going to be the case at all.

•The more I think about how Rod Marinelli is going to play his dime package, the more I believe that his one linebacker on the field will be Sean Lee, and to be honest, this should not come as any surprise. If you look at the current linebackers on the roster the ones that have the best cover skills are Rolando McClain, Anthony Hitchens and Lee. The coaches have been very cautious with Lee and not getting him involved in much team work, but keep an eye on what they do with him this week, working him potentially in some 7-on-7 drills where they continue to find ways to get him in the mix without taxing him physically. This type of work will surely make him happy after watching all last season in the early part of these camps.

•I really do like the prospects of Greg Hardy and Tyrone Crawford working together as nickel rushers, but in going back and studying some Hardy film from his days in Carolina -- I was also able to observe him play some under-tackle inside, as well. With what I have seen from Randy Gregory as a rusher, the thought of having both Hardy and Gregory coming off that right side seems to be an even better combination for their nickel package. I am not saying that we will see Hardy inside on the majority of the snaps because he is an elite rush end, but if Marinelli can get to a package where he has DeMarcus Lawrence, Tyrone Crawford, Greg Hardy and Randy Gregory on the field -- he is much closer to the type of pass rush that we see in Seattle.
 

L.T. Fan

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No I'm saying the difference is probably near negligible when talking about major conference schools.
I wasn't addressing that. I was commenting about why players from small schools are in small schools and why most pro prospects come from the Division 1 programs.
 

Cowboysrock55

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I wasn't addressing that. I was commenting about why players from small schools are in small schools and why most pro prospects come from the Division 1 programs.
Well of course. Not sure what that matters? What would matter is the bust rate or failure rate according to school. I mean when you have 6 first round prospects out of Alabama but 4 of them end up being busts and you have one guy say out of a small school like UConn who succeeds, then your odds are better by taking the small school prospect. (Purely hypothetical, I have no idea what the bust rates are by school/conference)
 

Jiggyfly

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It had to do with Townsend's post about small school players. Do you deliberately try to adgitate or it it you just don't read?
Look who's talking the guy that has admitted to trying to get me riled up before.

And Townsend's post was pertaining to Jones who is not a small school guy making the post kind of random.
 

L.T. Fan

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Look who's talking the guy that has admitted to trying to get me riled up before.

And Townsend's post was pertaining to Jones who is not a small school guy making the post kind of random.
You didnt read the other followup posts about small school players did you?
 

Chocolate Lab

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Some people just really like to argue, don't they?
 
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