2023 Draft Big Boards, Position Rankings & Mocks

[Chocolate Lab]

What do you guys think about Levis? Not where he will go but where he should go and how good he might be. Heard some national guy yesterday who said despite his tools, he was so bad last year he couldn't rank him very highly at all.

 

[boozeman]

What do you guys think about Levis? Not where he will go but where he should go and how good he might be. Heard some national guy yesterday who said despite his tools, he was so bad last year he couldn't rank him very highly at all.

He definitely had a bad season. He will get drafted high hoping he got bad coaching and his tools are enough.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

He definitely had a bad season. He will get drafted high hoping he got bad coaching and his tools are enough.

It's like Josh Allen who could barely complete 50% of his passes in college. Levis isn't a turd who can just throw the ball far. But he is going to need to put work in with the right coaches to be a good NFL starting QB. Perfect example of a guy who could go either way depending on his work ethic and who drafts him.

 

[Plan9Misfit]

 

[boozeman]

Pretty much a dream draft.

 

[Cujo]

As an OU fan, I'm glad that SOB is graduating.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Props on getting Addison, he never falls to me.

 

[boozeman]

As an OU fan, I'm glad that SOB is graduating.

Stop talking about him.

 

[Rev]

Props on getting Addison, he never falls to me.

I almost always have a choice between Nolan Smith, Bijan Robinson, Dalton Kincaid, or Deonte Banks out of the first two choices.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

I almost always have a choice between Nolan Smith, Bijan Robinson, Dalton Kincaid, or Deonte Banks out of the first two choices.

Yeah I wish there was more randomness to it. It's like Hyatt is always there with the second pick. Right now that would be a steal and very unlikely. But not much excitement in the mock draft when you just always see him there.

 

[Simpleton]

Random thought on the WR's as I'm starting to watch them more closely, but I'm starting to think Flowers is my 4th guy ahead of Hyatt, Downs and so forth. I want to see what he measures at exactly at the Combine and how he runs, but I think he's more polished/versatile as a route runner than Hyatt and better after the catch, while still providing an explosive element who can stretch defenses deep.

You have to take into account that he played in a more NFL-style offense with a pretty shitty passing game compared to someone like Hyatt who was in a wide-open offense known for inflated production. As a result the stats aren't quite as impressive, but when you factor in the relative percentage of their team's offense, Flowers was actually the more productive player.

I might even be convinced to bump him ahead of Johnston.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I might even be convinced to bump him ahead of Johnston.

This is probably totally unjustified, but I'm with crock55 in being a little wary of Johnston for some reason. Probably just wary because I thought Josh Doctson would be good, too.

That said, I'd be super excited if he started slipping a little and we got him.

 

[Simpleton]

This is probably totally unjustified, but I'm with crock55 in being a little wary of Johnston for some reason. Probably just wary because I thought Josh Doctson would be good, too.

That said, I'd be super excited if he started slipping a little and we got him.

Yea I'm not sure what to think of him really, his speed and the downfield threat he provides is very rare for his height/weight, but I hate WR's with unreliable hands. I'd probably be willing to roll the dice on the upside though.

If Njigba runs like a 4.5 I might even take Flowers over him also, assuming he runs in the low 4.4's.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Yea I'm not sure what to think of him really, his speed and the downfield threat he provides is very rare for his height/weight, but I hate WR's with unreliable hands. I'd probably be willing to roll the dice on the upside though.

If Njigba runs like a 4.5 I might even take Flowers over him also, assuming he runs in the low 4.4's.

I'm sort of hoping Njigba runs a 4.5. It's the only way I see him making it to our pick and I think he is legit. I don't get that wrapped up in 40s unless it's something alarming. Njigba isn't going to be a Hyatt like deep threat. Antonio Brown for example ran a 4.57 forty if I remember correctly. No one is going to call him slow, he was a stellar route runner and got separation. To me that's sort of like Njigba.

Now back to Flowers. He kind of reminds me of a prospect on the level of Dotson last year. Smaller, stupid quick and shifty. Plays bigger than he is. I thought Dotson was an early day 2 or late day 1 WR. He ended up going mid first. I see a lot of similarities to Flowers who is maybe slightly shorter.

And Hyatt I've said it before, I want to see how he looks running routes. His speed reminds me of Jameson Williams last year without the injury. He isn't a small receiver but he's not a big receiver either. But the guy can absolutely fly. You can see guys running full speed who will be NFL draft picks and he is easily pulling away from them. It's crazy impressive. I've seen him run slants, deep routes and basically short quick screens. I want to see the other stuff though. At minimum I don't think NFL defensive coordinators will feel comfortable leaving him in man coverage because of his speed. So they will either use zone or have to keep a safety over the top. That's a big deal when you have Ceedee Lamb on the other side. Suddenly you have to pick your poison to some extent. I like that.

Those are my thoughts on the players at least. I think you see 4 or 5 WRs go in the first round.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I would totally ignore the offense Hyatt plays in. At one time people used similar thinking on Air Raid QBs, and then Patrick Mahomes happened. If the guy has the ability, he has the ability.

Besides, we better get used to it because that offense is only getting more popular with colleges.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

I would totally ignore the offense Hyatt plays in. At one time people used similar thinking on Air Raid QBs, and then Patrick Mahomes happened. If the guy has the ability, he has the ability.

Besides, we better get used to it because that offense is only getting more popular with colleges.

It's funny to me that people knock Hyatt for it but then want to draft Hooker. Hooker also played in that offense.

 

[Simpleton]

I'm sort of hoping Njigba runs a 4.5. It's the only way I see him making it to our pick and I think he is legit. I don't get that wrapped up in 40s unless it's something alarming. Njigba isn't going to be a Hyatt like deep threat. Antonio Brown for example ran a 4.57 forty if I remember correctly. No one is going to call him slow, he was a stellar route runner and got separation. To me that's sort of like Njigba.

Now back to Flowers. He kind of reminds me of a prospect on the level of Dotson last year. Smaller, stupid quick and shifty. Plays bigger than he is. I thought Dotson was an early day 2 or late day 1 WR. He ended up going mid first. I see a lot of similarities to Flowers who is maybe slightly shorter.

And Hyatt I've said it before, I want to see how he looks running routes. His speed reminds me of Jameson Williams last year without the injury. He isn't a small receiver but he's not a big receiver either. But the guy can absolutely fly. You can see guys running full speed who will be NFL draft picks and he is easily pulling away from them. It's crazy impressive. I've seen him run slants, deep routes and basically short quick screens. I want to see the other stuff though. At minimum I don't think NFL defensive coordinators will feel comfortable leaving him in man coverage because of his speed. So they will either use zone or have to keep a safety over the top. That's a big deal when you have Ceedee Lamb on the other side. Suddenly you have to pick your poison to some extent. I like that.

Those are my thoughts on the players at least. I think you see 4 or 5 WRs go in the first round.

I also thought of Dotson when it comes to Flowers, and if that's the case he's a guy that would be more than fine at 26 considering the relative weakness of this first round.

We'll see on Njigba, I'd also be fine with him even if he runs a 4.5, I could just be convinced of Flowers given his deep speed and the fact that he's also a really good route runner with good hands.

Hyatt has the deep linear speed for sure, I just worry about how he'd be used in our offense. That could just be a function of watching Garrett/Moore/Linehan offenses forever and maybe now they'll have a specific role in mind tailored around his specific skillset, but I think Flowers brings nearly as much value as a deep threat while being safer in other areas.

 

[Simpleton]

I would totally ignore the offense Hyatt plays in. At one time people used similar thinking on Air Raid QBs, and then Patrick Mahomes happened. If the guy has the ability, he has the ability.

Besides, we better get used to it because that offense is only getting more popular with colleges.

Mahomes was curated and developed into the QB he is today by Reid within his offensive structure with wrinkles added here and there, he didn't just jump in and start rolling NFL defenses with the exact same offensive structure he played in in college.

The issue with the scheme is that Hyatt didn't run a well-rounded route tree and there's uncertainty around whether he'll be able to do that in the NFL. He'd still have value as a deep threat if he can't, but my point about the systems they played in is more that Flowers is an easier projection due to the routes he was asked to run, while his stats were likely deflated due to the system he was in, whereas Hyatt's were inflated.

Basically, if you took Flowers and put him in Tennessee's system while removing Hyatt, you'd see equal or better production in my opinion.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Mahomes was curated and developed into the QB he is today by Reid within his offensive structure with wrinkles added here and there, he didn't just jump in and start rolling NFL defenses with the exact same offensive structure he played in in college.

The issue with the scheme is that Hyatt didn't run a well-rounded route tree and there's uncertainty around whether he'll be able to do that in the NFL. He'd still have value as a deep threat if he can't, but my point about the systems they played in is more that Flowers is an easier projection due to the routes he was asked to run, while his stats were likely deflated due to the system he was in, whereas Hyatt's were inflated.

I understand that, of course they'll need NFL coaching. But the point is, they should be able to learn to do whatever as long as they have the ability to do so. Didn't Calvin Johnson and Demaryius Thomas play in wishbone/option offenses? Johnson may have been prior to that era but I know Thomas did. IMO any decent scout should be able to make that projection.

And me personally, I always go by my own judgment in what my eyes see on players. I never care about stats for just the reason you mention. That is where Air Raid QBs and WRs get overdrafted.

 

[Simpleton]

I understand that, of course they'll need NFL coaching. But the point is, they should be able to learn to do whatever as long as they have the ability to do so. Didn't Calvin Johnson and Demaryius Thomas play in wishbone/option offenses? Johnson may have been prior to that era but I know Thomas did. IMO any decent scout should be able to make that projection.

And me personally, I always go by my own judgment in what my eyes see on players. I never care about stats for just the reason you mention. That is where Air Raid QBs and WRs get overdrafted.

It's one thing when someone is as clearly as elite of a prospect as Johnson, it's another when you're kind of splitting hairs to figure out who makes the most sense. I don't think there is much separating Hyatt and Flowers, with Flowers having shown more versatility partly due to the system each played in, so there you go.

I'm not saying never take any players from a certain system, Addison is my favorite WR in the draft and played under Kingsbury last year.

Although Heupel's system is even more extreme I think, specifically due to the splits the WR's take.