Game Day Chatter Thread | Week 4 | Cowboys @ Saints | 09/29/19

[Smitty]

So one of those "hot" innovative wave-of-the-future offensive savant coaches that the DCC pines for in 'Zac Taylor' gets his ass beat 27-3 by a team replacing its injured future-HOF QB with a dink-n-dunker (sound familiar?).

Hell, we scored 333% more points than 'whoever else is out there' coach replacement.

Face it. Garrett gives this team its best chance right now and for the next several years.

I mean, yeah, if we are getting Lincoln Riley, sign me up. If we are getting Zac Taylor, I’ll stick with Garrett and Moore.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

You have to admit, though, that it's total nonsense to say "I don't know if I agree" that they ran more on first down in this game.

I mean, it's math.

Why would Garrett or anyone even say that? What does he have to gain? What secret is he hiding from the media in saying something so ridiculous?

 

[Angrymesscan]

4th time in 6 years

So Arians gets 3 appearances in 7 years coaching (the seven being his finishing the year as interim and the current season) and Garrett 4 of 6? Is it me or does this look a lot like cherry picking?

 

[data]

I mean, yeah, if we are getting Lincoln Riley, sign me up. If we are getting Zac Taylor, I’ll stick with Garrett and Moore.

Feh to Riley. How did Chip Kelly work out for the Eagles and 49ers? How about Nick Saban for the Dolphins? Steve Spurrier?

We need a no-doubt upgrade with proven Super Bowl track record. I’d only get rid of Garrett for Belichick or Sean Payton. Harbaugh, Tomlin, Pederson and Carroll have already lost their luster.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

You have to admit, though, that it's total nonsense to say "I don't know if I agree" that they ran more on first down in this game.

I mean, it's math.

Why would Garrett or anyone even say that? What does he have to gain? What secret is he hiding from the media in saying something so ridiculous?

I'm not really sure but it seems like he either has no idea or he is afraid to admit that his game plan was to pound Zeke to victory. Which is fine but then when that isn't working I'm just not sure why we aren't capable of pivoting to something else. There is a flaw somewhere in the system we have set up if we aren't capable of making that adjustment on game day. And that's why you're not going to have success in the playoffs because if you don't have the right plan in place the game is lost before it ever starts.

And no I don't agree with this "most coaches" argument. You're not going against most coaches in the playoffs. You're going against the best. If talent is close the better coach will win.

 

[Smitty]

You have to admit, though, that it's total nonsense to say "I don't know if I agree" that they ran more on first down in this game.

I mean, it's math.

Why would Garrett or anyone even say that? What does he have to gain? What secret is he hiding from the media in saying something so ridiculous?

The better question is who cares?

Its simply not believable that he doesn’t understand basic math, and anyone trying to sell me that he’s so dumb that he doesn’t get it, must be that dumb themselves.

He’s being evasive and I give fuck all about whether his answers please any of you.

 

[Smitty]

So Arians gets 3 appearances in 7 years coaching (the seven being his finishing the year as interim and the current season) and Garrett 4 of 6? Is it me or does this look a lot like cherry picking?

No? I‘m projecting, rather safely I feel, that we will make the playoffs this year and the Buccaneers will miss. We can revisit those numbers if anything changes, but the percentages won’t be drastically different.

 

[Smitty]

Feh to Riley. How did Chip Kelly work out for the Eagles and 49ers? How about Nick Saban for the Dolphins? Steve Spurrier?

We need a no-doubt upgrade with proven Super Bowl track record. I’d only get rid of Garrett for Belichick or Sean Payton. Harbaugh, Tomlin, Pederson and Carroll have already lost their luster.

You go with that.

I’m just fine if we target a high end guy like Riley who I feel really solid about. Of course anything could go wrong and he might not work out, but there’s enough there to believe he’ll be a good offensive mind like McVay.

But if I have to scrape the dregs for Zac Taylor? Fuck that. Sure, some of those guys WILL work out and be better than Garrett, but we won’t be the team that finds which ones.

We need the near-slam dunk.

 

[data]

You go with that.

I’m just fine if we target a high end guy like Riley who I feel really solid about. Of course anything could go wrong and he might not work out, but there’s enough there to believe he’ll be a good offensive mind like McVay.

But if I have to scrape the dregs for Zac Taylor? Fuck that. Sure, some of those guys WILL work out and be better than Garrett, but we won’t be the team that finds which ones.

We need the near-slam dunk.

Lincoln Riley graduated from Texas Tech. yech. Probably took the shuttle everywhere he went.

 

[UncleMilti]

Most NFL coaches will give you the same vague, misleading answers to reporter’s questions, and have the same “baffling” game plans with just about the same frequency as Garrett does.

And by “most” I mean coaches not named Payton or Belichick, or maybe Reid.

Garrett will eventually be gone from here, but unless you gain some perspective on your Monday Morning Second Guessing, you are gonna be just as unhappy with the coaching staff as we all were with Wade, Parcells (yes, Parcells and everyone’s now favorite Sean Payton were heavily criticized for both offensive and defensive schemes while here), Campo, Gailey, etc.

The criticisms you lob at the staff are uninformed and lack nuance tremendously. You will end up disappointed by the next hire if this is your standard, unless we luck into a Hall of Famer.

Somehow, the clueless idiot is probably headed to the playoffs again for 4th time in 6 years with one of the two misses being when they lost their starting QB for the year in week 2. Amazing. Does coaching even matter if a clueless idiot can ride talent to that kind of consistency? Because if it doesn’t matter, then why are we complaining? And if it does matter, then how have we pulled off such consistency?

I watch a ton of sports, and I will say without reservation that Garrett and the Jones family are usually clueless when in front of the media. I see very few other NFL coaches zoned out like Garrett seems to be.

As far as your other comments..... talk about throwing stones from a glass house. I’m no more “uninformed” about Garrett or football in general than you or anyone else here. You can’t back up your defense of Garrett any more than I can defend my criticism of Garrett and his staff. It’s all opinion.

But the beautiful thing about Father Time is it allows facts to gather dust, and the facts we DO have are 10 years of Garrett history to look back on, and the stats and facts don’t lie. It’s in black and white the coaching gaffes, the losing big games, the let downs of losing to far inferior teams, the arrogant refusal to change game plans, and the lack of success in the postseason.

Garrett is like a movie you’ve seen 5 times and it’s so sad that you hope the ending somehow changes each time you watch it. Except it doesn’t, just like Garrett and big games or the chance of a SB...the ending will never change.

 

[NoDak]

I’d only get rid of Garrett for Belichick or Sean Payton.

This might be one of the stupidest things ever posted here. Props.

 

[Smitty]

I watch a ton of sports, and I will say without reservation that Garrett and the Jones family are usually clueless when in front of the media. I see very few other NFL coaches zoned out like Garrett seems to be.

As far as your other comments..... talk about throwing stones from a glass house. I’m no more “uninformed” about Garrett or football in general than you or anyone else here. You can’t back up your defense of Garrett any more than I can defend my criticism of Garrett and his staff. It’s all opinion.

But the beautiful thing about Father Time is it allows facts to gather dust, and the facts we DO have are 10 years of Garrett history to look back on, and the stats and facts don’t lie. It’s in black and white the coaching gaffes, the losing big games, the let downs of losing to far inferior teams, the arrogant refusal to change game plans, and the lack of success in the postseason.

Garrett is like a movie you’ve seen 5 times and it’s so sad that you hope the ending somehow changes each time you watch it. Except it doesn’t, just like Garrett and big games or the chance of a SB...the ending will never change.

You keep saying untrue things like “it’s black and white.” It’s not black and white. It’s anecdotal.

The only black and white things are his win-loss record and the lack of advancement to the championship game. Those are facts, but they are also weighed in comparison against his recent history, which is heavily skewed towards substantially better than average regular season success in comparison to his peers, and in terms of playoff appearances and division titles.

All your complaints boil boil down to completely unquantifiable personal animus: “coaching gaffes,” as if that’s (a) even a defined term, rather than something completely subjective, and (b) as if there was any evidence proving he was any worse than anyone else in quantity. Same goes for “losing to inferior opponents.” Have you done a study on this? No? “Arrogant refusal to change the game plan.” You literally do not know either what the game plan was, nor do you know whether they changed; it’s all (mostly) uninformed speculation on your part.

Then people want to bring up Belichick and Payton like that fucking means anything. Yeah, when we can hire Payton or Belichick I’ll personally throw Garrett off a bridge myself.

Until then, the Garrett criticisms remain no more than that: anecdotal, unsubstantiated bitching almost exclusively.

The salient points worth discussing are: he hasn’t won big. He hasn’t gotten over the hump. But the solution to this problem requires a very precise hire, which is why I have put up such steadfast opposition to a punitive firing and instead thrown support behind a targeted upgrade..... which IS available.

 

[UncleMilti]

You keep saying untrue things like “it’s black and white.” It’s not black and white. It’s anecdotal.

The only black and white things are his win-loss record and the lack of advancement to the championship game. Those are facts, but they are also weighed in comparison against his recent history, which is heavily skewed towards substantially better than average regular season success in comparison to his peers, and in terms of playoff appearances and division titles.

All your complaints boil boil down to completely unquantifiable personal animus: “coaching gaffes,” as if that’s (a) even a defined term, rather than something completely subjective, and (b) as if there was any evidence proving he was any worse than anyone else in quantity. Same goes for “losing to inferior opponents.” Have you done a study on this? No? “Arrogant refusal to change the game plan.” You literally do not know either what the game plan was, nor do you know whether they changed; it’s all (mostly) uninformed speculation on your part.

Then people want to bring up Belichick and Payton like that fucking means anything. Yeah, we we can hire Payton or Belichick I’ll personally throw Garrett off a bridge myself.

Until then, the Garrett criticisms remain no more than that: anecdotal, unsubstantiated bitching almost exclusively.

The salient points worth discussing are: he hasn’t won big. He hasn’t gotten over the hump. But the solution to this problem requires a very precise hire, which is why I have put up such steadfast opposition to a punitive firing and instead thrown support behind a targeted upgrade..... which IS available.

By all means, you’ll defend Garrett till the cows come home.

As far as the rest of your novel...Lol....OMG. We certainly do know the game plans because numerous people like Sturm and others break down each game. We know the in-game mistakes and head scratching decisions because Sturm and others highlight them. Sturm does a nice job breaking down Cowboys games and backs it up using...DATA. But why listen to him, I’m sure it’s all unsubstantiated and anecdotal. Because you know, charts and graphs, facts and numbers are also unsubstantiated and anecdotal in your world when it comes to Garrett.

 

[Smitty]

By all means, you’ll defend Garrett till the cows come home.

As far as the rest of your novel...Lol....OMG. We certainly do know the game plans because numerous people like Sturm and others break down each game. We know the in-game mistakes and head scratching decisions because Sturm and others highlight them. Sturm does a nice job breaking down Cowboys games and backs it up using...DATA. But why listen to him, I’m sure it’s all unsubstantiated and anecdotal. Because you know, charts and graphs, facts and numbers are also unsubstantiated and anecdotal in your world when it comes to Garrett.

Sturm breaks down a lot of stuff, but I also don't hear him sitting here saying Garrett "does nothing," or he's "a clueless idiot."

And he doesn't say that because he knows his breakdowns wouldn't substantiate that Garrett is anything worse than an average head coach if he extended them league wide. Which is once again the entire genesis of this debate: I push back on non-factual, anecdotal, unsubstantiated griping about "all the" x, y, or z that Garrett does, which is not catalogued in comparison to other coaches for context. Because without that, it's pointless Joe Fan complaining on spec. I watch a lot of sports too: I hear fans complaining about the head coaches of literally every team I follow in every sport. Even Roy fucking Williams at UNC. People think he's a bad game day coach or some nonsense. Yeah, maybe compared to like 2 other Hall of Famers.

Of course Sturm's data makes the argument we could improve. Which is why I've said again and again I'm in favor of a targeted upgrade.

 

[Cotton]

This was such a bullshit call.

 

[Simpleton]

The second one was even more non-descript. It was a very odd game overall, the Saints offense never really felt threatening but they held the ball for long periods of time, our offense was shitty most of the night but each time they seemed to get a little something going there'd be a questionable call, dropped pass or fumble. It wasn't complete incompetence really, but they just couldn't string plays together.

 

[Smitty]

The second one was even more non-descript. It was a very odd game overall, the Saints offense never really felt threatening but they held the ball for long periods of time, our offense was shitty most of the night but each time they seemed to get a little something going there'd be a questionable call, dropped pass or fumble. It wasn't complete incompetence really, but they just couldn't string plays together.

Not worth hitting the panic button yet.

And it a nutshell, neither would losing to Green Bay, but when we do it and it's back to back losses this weekend, this place is going to implode.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Not worth hitting the panic button yet.

And it a nutshell, neither would losing to Green Bay, but when we do it and it's back to back losses this weekend, this place is going to implode.

I don't always agree with you but I agree on this. The season is a marathon and not a sprint. We need to be in the playoffs and hopefully rolling towards the end of the season. We just need to find our groove again. We do that and these losses don't matter.

 

[Rev]

Not worth hitting the panic button yet.

And it a nutshell, neither would losing to Green Bay, but when we do it and it's back to back losses this weekend, this place is going to implode.

It will and I will probably take a break from readimg the board. Its tiring.

 

[Smitty]

It will and I will probably take a break from readimg the board. Its tiring.

I'm going on vacation on Friday so you bastards won't have me around to bring reason to the GDC thread.