Mock drafts: ‘Athletic freak’ Anthony Barr gaining momentum as possible Cowboys pick

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mschmidt64 said:
If Peyton Manning and Andrew Luck are 10.0, Ryan Leaf is a 0.0 (in retrospect), and Eric Fisher an 8.5, I'd say Matthews and Robinson are like 9.6 or 9.7s, Lewan is a 9.0, Martin is an 8.2.

In my mind, Matthews and Robinson are #1 overall pick type tackles, if Clowney wasn't also a transcendant talent. Lewan is a stud, but his grade is more on the level of a Tyron Smith who at the time I really, really liked, but I wasn't ranking him as the best player in the class, either.

Zach Martin is more on the level of a Jonathan Martin when Jonathan Martin came out. Mid first rounder. In a comparison to Tyron Smith's class again, Zach Martin's grade is more like Nate Solder's. I'd be fine with the pick.... but not before Tyron Smith. The two players are definitely not a "toss up." One is clearly better than the other.

Eric Fisher is a very nice player and better than either Martin, but might not be a top 10 pick in this draft and definitely wouldn't be a top 5 pick in this draft. Actually I would have had Luke Joekel ahead of Eric Fisher last year, and Joekel would have been more like 8.8 or 9.0, more up there with Lewan.
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good stuff.
 
boozeman

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mschmidt64 said:
Zach Martin is more on the level of a Jonathan Martin when Jonathan Martin came out. Mid first rounder. In a comparison to Tyron Smith's class again, Zach Martin's grade is more like Nate Solder's. I'd be fine with the pick.... but not before Tyron Smith. The two players are definitely not a "toss up." One is clearly better than the other.
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Jonathan Martin was a second round pick. He was never regarded as a player that teams coveted.

Zack Martin is considered one of the cleanest prospects in this draft. That is the type of player you would be fortunate to find in the middle of the first round.
 
boozeman

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Iamtdg said:
Sure there can, but there isn't a clear difference between Martin and Lewan.
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There kind of is.

Lewan is the athletic specimen that Martin isn't. The shorter arms are a deal with teams thinking Martin can play LT.

Martin is a crisp clean prospect with no baggage. Lewan has baggage.

But teams do value athletic gifts more than character most of the time.

Personally I like Martin a lot, but I won't say he's got the growth potential of Lewan to be a stud tackle.

Martin is a guy who ends up playing inside and making a half dozen Pro Bowls. Lewan might have a career like Jake Long.

I know who I would take for the Cowboys.

The biggest problem we have is that there are very few players we can just put on the field and not have to worry about. Martin would be one of those guys.
 
Smitty

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boozeman said:
Jonathan Martin was a second round pick. He was never regarded as a player that teams coveted.

Zack Martin is considered one of the cleanest prospects in this draft. That is the type of player you would be fortunate to find in the middle of the first round.
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There were mocks with Jonathan Martin in the first for weeks. He was usually in the late teens or 20s.
 
ravidubey

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mschmidt64 said:
Ok, so you agree Mike Evans is a different category though.

So that means among first rounders there can be clear differences.
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As I said in the first sentence, after the obvious difference-makers there is little difference. Top ten implies all single digit picks are great prospects, and in my experience it's more like top six or even top four.

In 2013, it was top-none... as in little to no difference between Dion Jordan and Luke Joeckel and Travis Frederick.
 
Smitty

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ravidubey said:
As I said in the first sentence, after the obvious difference-makers there is little difference. Top ten implies all single digit picks are great prospects, and in my experience it's more like top six or even top four.

In 2013, it was top-none... as in little to no difference between Dion Jordan and Luke Joeckel and Travis Frederick.
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Well what I'm saying is that Lewan is in that group that is the difference makers and Martin isn't.
 
Cowboysrock55

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Simpleton said:
Martin looks like a much better OG prospect than Martin did at OT.
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I just want my guards to be looked at as physically dominating run blockers. Strength is a big deal on the interior. I don't see that with Martin.
 
NoDak

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Iamtdg said:
There is almost zero chance Lewan drops to 16.
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Huh? You're saying there isn't much difference between Lewan and Martin. And that you'd like Martin at 16, but there is almost zero chance Lewan would make it there?

Almost sounds like there is a clear difference between the two...

:tippytoe
 
Cotton

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NoDak said:
Huh? You're saying there isn't much difference between Lewan and Martin. And that you'd like Martin at 16, but there is almost zero chance Lewan would make it there?

Almost sounds like there is a clear difference between the two...

:tippytoe
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Nope. Just saying that there are teams that have a major need at tackle and Lewan is the more talented overall of the two. With Matthews and Robinson going top 5-7, there will be teams snatching up Lewan 8-10. Maybe the Bills at 11 But, I also wouldn't be surprised to see Martin gone by the very next pick.
 
boozeman

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mschmidt64 said:
I meant someone who we on this board generally like.

I have no idea what our fucked up front office will do.
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Dunno, my list is getting kind of short.

Donald - Gone
Barr - Okay, but iffy a little, probably gone
Martin - Yes, but probably gone
Beckham - Yes, but almost certain to be gone
Manziel - Yes, almost certain to be gone, but Jerry says no anyways even if
Shazier - Iffy, getting more skeptical instead of less
Clinton-Dix - Not impressed, basically neutral
Pryor - Same as above
Jernigan - Dunno if value due to drug thing
Ealy - No effin' way
 
Smitty

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boozeman said:
Dunno, my list is getting kind of short.

Donald - Gone
Barr - Okay, but iffy a little, probably gone
Martin - Yes, but probably gone
Beckham - Yes, but almost certain to be gone
Manziel - Yes, almost certain to be gone, but Jerry says no anyways even if
Shazier - Iffy, getting more skeptical instead of less
Clinton-Dix - Not impressed, basically neutral
Pryor - Same as above
Jernigan - Dunno if value due to drug thing
Ealy - No effin' way
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Where are the guys who are going to go earlier than 16 on your list? If Lewan, Clowney, Robinson, Matthews, Mack, Evans, and Watkins are also gone, that's 7. Then your list has another 5 that you said "probably gone" but that's not factoring in a lot of other guys who will go, including a couple DBs, another QB, Ebron, etc.

I would say it's extremely likely that Martin or Beckham IS there.

Frankly I still think ONE of Barr, Donald, or Lewan will be there.

Probably Barr.
 
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