2nd Round Pick: Luke Schoonmaker, TE, Michigan

[Cowboysrock55]

The scouts think he's capable of threatening vertically up the seam, which theoretically makes sense with his size and straight line speed, but it just feels like a lazy pick because they wanted a safe bet at TE and he's it, and now they're trying to pump him up into more than he is.

He'll be a fine player but it's gonna be a god damn miracle if he ever becomes a Pro Bowl caliber player.

I've got more excitement about Ferguson than this kid. Which isn't a knock on the guy as much as it shows I think highly of Ferg and his play making ability. It also highlights that if we weren't getting a dynamic TE there really wasn't a reason to take one this early. This kid is faster but when it comes to making plays after the catch I think Ferguson looks better. Schoon will run away from people better but he isn't difficult to tackle and doesn't make people miss.

Ultimately I just don't think it's going to be good value but with all draft picks I could be wrong. He is a rock solid player but with TEs you are either dynamic or you're kind of the same with everyone else. I don't see dynamic.

 

[shoop]

For the most part, take Torrence in the second and this guy or overshown in the third and it would have been a more tolerable draft.

 

[bbgun]

For the most part, take Torrence in the second and this guy or overshown in the third and it would have been a more tolerable draft.

Torrence obviously has flaws, otherwise he wouldn't have dropped like he did. Still, I'll take a starting guard over a third tight end.

 

[Simpleton]

For the most part, take Torrence in the second and this guy or overshown in the third and it would have been a more tolerable draft.

I would've called that a home run actually, although if you look at the board when we picked in the second it wasn't as stacked as I thought at the time. The board really got picked clean between Mayer, LaPorta, Musgrave, Bergeron, Mauch, Avila and Charbonnet.

The only guys I feel really strongly that we should've taken are Torrence, Downs, Hyatt, Drew Sanders and Kraft, although I'm not really going to blame them for their evaluation having Schoonmaker in front of Kraft.

 

[Smitty]

Downs shoulda been the pick.

 

[Simpleton]

Downs shoulda been the pick.

I would've gone elsewhere but if I had to guess their rationale was that Schoonmaker could be our top TE and even if he's only our number 2, that's more important than a 4th WR, particularly one who doesn't fit the ideal size prototype that McCarthy supposedly wants, or a backup OL.

It's short sighted but I think that was probably the line of thinking.

 

[p1_]

Its almost as if Jones was pissed he couldnt/didnt draft Mayer at 26.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Its almost as if Jones was pissed he couldnt/didnt draft Mayer at 26.

I don't think we were as high on Mayer as all the insiders thought. I really think LaPorta was above him on our draft board. I think LaPorta could have been a weapon here but those damn Lions and their love for Iowa players.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

I would've gone elsewhere but if I had to guess their rationale was that Schoonmaker could be our top TE and even if he's only our number 2, that's more important than a 4th WR, particularly one who doesn't fit the ideal size prototype that McCarthy supposedly wants, or a backup OL.

It's short sighted but I think that was probably the line of thinking.

Hyatt, Kendre Miller, Tillman and Torrence. I don't think a WR we drafted would have been #4 for long. I want explosion on offense. I think it's important for guys to be able to catch the ball and do things.

Poontaker is sort of the opposite. Uncover quickly, catch the ball and go down. Great run blocker so you can kind of grind and move the chains. Not much explosion to the offense but probably more grinding ability. Instead of rolling out 3 WRs (were your fourth guy is getting a lot of snaps) we will roll more with 2 TEs I assume. Basically making it so we don't use a fourth WR much but instead need 3 good TEs.

Anyway, I get this was a philosophical move but I don't know that it's the philosophy I would pick. I prefer to spread defenses out and back safeties off. When you go heavy like this you just sort of cram the box and tighten running lanes.

 

[ZeroClub]

Hyatt, Kendre Miller, Tillman and Torrence. I don't think a WR we drafted would have been #4 for long. I want explosion on offense. I think it's important for guys to be able to catch the ball and do things.

Poontaker is sort of the opposite. Uncover quickly, catch the ball and go down. Great run blocker so you can kind of grind and move the chains. Not much explosion to the offense but probably more grinding ability. Instead of rolling out 3 WRs (were your fourth guy is getting a lot of snaps) we will roll more with 2 TEs I assume. Basically making it so we don't use a fourth WR much but instead need 3 good TEs.

Anyway, I get this was a philosophical move but I don't know that it's the philosophy I would pick. I prefer to spread defenses out and back safeties off. When you go heavy like this you just sort of cram the box and tighten running lanes.

Yes, I also think McCarthy wants to grind the ball and that this TE pick, in particular, reflects that philosophy (as does Luepke, assuming he makes the team and gets playing time).

An optimistic spin on this -- McCarthy is installing a new offense with a team that he knows extremely well. McCarthy has very closely observed the strengths and weaknesses of Dak and other personnel over multiple seasons. In this way, McCarthy is especially well positioned. It is unusual for the coach who installs a new offensive to know and understand his personnel as well as McCarthy knows his. I think there is a decent chance that he knows what he needs.

 

[bbgun]

true, but if we had a chance at Torrence in the second and Schoo in the third ...

 

[Simpleton]

true, but if we had a chance at Torrence in the second and Schoo in the third ...

If I had to guess we probably weren't interested in him for a few reasons, stupid ones to be sure, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if they had Schoonmaker ranked higher.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

true, but if we had a chance at Torrence in the second and Schoo in the third ...

The argument would be what if he doesn't make it all the way to the late third! My argument would be who cares. But I guess if you really loved him that much more than the other TEs.

Personally I would have been good with Whyle in the fifth and used the draft for other things.

 

[bbgun]

what was the knock on Torrence? not strong enough? bad 40 time? bad reputation?

 

[Chocolate Lab]

I seriously doubt Schoon would have made it to our third rounder. TE Strange went only three picks later, and Schoon placed much higher than him in the McGinn scouts poll, 11 to 4.

Also on that note, it's weird that the CBS grader, whoever that is, gave us a C- for the pick and the Jags an A- for their pick of Strange only three spots later. Again, on a player the McGinn scouts liked less.

I think the scouting community simply liked Schoon more than the public did.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

what was the knock on Torrence? not strong enough? bad 40 time? bad reputation?

Lack of position flex would be my guess. Not the quickest feet to pull and make second level blocks.

He is great at holding the pocket clean and knocking guys backwards in the run game. Which is what I find most important at LG.

 

[Simpleton]

Lack of position flex would be my guess. Not the quickest feet to pull and make second level blocks.

He is great at holding the pocket clean and knocking guys backwards in the run game. Which is what I find most important at LG.

Yea lack of position flex and perhaps being gap-scheme only.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

what was the knock on Torrence? not strong enough? bad 40 time? bad reputation?

Yeah, I guess that he didn't move well enough. I think we laymen always overrate size and underrate quick feet and agility. If you can't get in position it doesn't matter how big and strong you are.

 

[Simpleton]

I seriously doubt Schoon would have made it to our third rounder. TE Strange went only three picks later, and Schoon placed much higher in the McGinn scouts poll, 11 to 4.

Also on that note, it's weird that the CBS grader, whoever that is, gave us a C- for the pick and the Jags an A- for their pick of Strange only three spots later. Again, on a player the McGinn scouts liked less.

I think the scouting community simply liked Schoon more than the public did.

Yea I think Schoonmaker is definitely better than Strange, Latu also went higher than expected and was arguably a reach at the end of the 3rd so TE's were just flying off the board.

But I would've been fine kicking the can down the road and taking Payne Durham in the 5th.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Also on that note, it's weird that the CBS grader, whoever that is, gave us a C- for the pick and the Jags an A- for their pick of Strange only three spots later. Again, on a player the McGinn scouts liked less.

Yeah I don't worry much about grades. I just worry about players. I hope I'm wrong on Schoon and he ends up the next Kittle or Goedert at least. I'm not high on Overshown but maybe he is great and becomes a mainstay at LBer for us. A LBer version of Kearse or something like that.

As of today though I didn't like Poonmaker that high and am just not a fan over Overshown.