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Sturm: Pondering The Present And Future Of Jason Witten

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  • #16
    Originally posted by mschmidt64 View Post
    Uh.... no. We are trying to blame his downfield targets declining on Dak, not his YPC.

    No one said it's all Dak. My words were, if you cared to examine them instead of jumping to unreasonable conclusions, I wonder if it's something that should not just be dismissed out of hand as Sturm does in this article. Implying it could be substantially both things.
    That chart isn't YPC, it's yards AFTER catch.

    Seems to me that YAC has very little to do with our discussion though.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Genghis Khan View Post
      That chart isn't YPC, it's yards AFTER catch.

      Seems to me that YAC has very little to do with our discussion though.
      YAC has everything to do with it. As a player becomes worse and worse he is going to get less and less YAC. YAC indicates separation and explosive ability with the ball in his hands. A 1.6 indicates a total lack of any of those traits. That has to be one of the worst YAC per reception in the NFL.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Cowboysrock55 View Post
        YAC has everything to do with it. As a player becomes worse and worse he is going to get less and less YAC. YAC indicates separation and explosive ability with the ball in his hands. A 1.6 indicates a total lack of any of those traits. That has to be one of the worst YAC per reception in the NFL.
        No, it doesn’t have everything to do with it. He’s always been poor at YAC. Sturm has another chart that his downfield targets have dried up as well. Obviously some of that is based on a decrease in explosiveness but since he did still do it occasionally as the chart showed, it meant he still was physically capable to sow extent. Wondering to what extent it was the QB cannot be answered by a YAC average.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by mschmidt64 View Post
          No, it doesn’t have everything to do with it. He’s always been poor at YAC. Sturm has another chart that his downfield targets have dried up as well. Obviously some of that is based on a decrease in explosiveness but since he did still do it occasionally as the chart showed, it meant he still was physically capable to sow extent. Wondering to what extent it was the QB cannot be answered by a YAC average.
          We threw to him downfield less last season because he is slow as dirt. Which is shown by the 1.7 yards after catch average. Which was by far the worst of his career.

          The guy is 36 and slow as hell. This isn't rocket science. Players don't last forever.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Cowboysrock55 View Post
            We threw to him downfield less last season because he is slow as dirt. Which is shown by the 1.7 yards after catch average. Which was by far the worst of his career.

            The guy is 36 and slow as hell. This isn't rocket science. Players don't last forever.
            No, this chart does not prove any of that.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by mschmidt64 View Post
              No, this chart does not prove any of that.
              So what do you think it means when a guy can't do much more than fall down after catching the ball. A number that is far below his career rate? You think that has nothing to do with Witten? You really argue just to argue.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Cowboysrock55 View Post
                So what do you think it means when a guy can't do much more than fall down after catching the ball. A number that is far below his career rate? You think that has nothing to do with Witten? You really argue just to argue.
                I think it means this:

                http://www.dallascowboyscentral.com/...l=1#post416778

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by mschmidt64 View Post
                  You do realize his YAC is way lower than it's been his entire career right? You can't just brush that off with a statement that he's always been bad at running after the catch. Because he has never been this bad. Not even close really.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Cowboysrock55 View Post
                    You do realize his YAC is way lower than it's been his entire career right? You can't just brush that off with a statement that he's always been bad at running after the catch. Because he has never been this bad. Not even close really.
                    And you also can't brush off the QB change when these struggles obviously coincide with it, and that he did in fact get downfield occasionally still.

                    It seems extremely unlikely to me that the two have zero to do with each other. I am not saying to what extent is which, but I think it's wrong to brush it off, as Sturm did (and as you are doing) as negligible.

                    That's more like apologizing for Dak's clear weaknesses. I think any accurate analysis of this issue has to look at Dak's targets of Witten in that downfield range as opposed to previous seasons with different QBs.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Cowboysrock55 View Post
                      You do realize his YAC is way lower than it's been his entire career right? You can't just brush that off with a statement that he's always been bad at running after the catch. Because he has never been this bad. Not even close really.
                      The 3 most used words at the DCC.
                      2016 DCC LOTY Fantasy Football Champion

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by mschmidt64 View Post
                        And you also can't brush off the QB change when these struggles obviously coincide with it, and that he did in fact get downfield occasionally still.

                        It seems extremely unlikely to me that the two have zero to do with each other. I am not saying to what extent is which, but I think it's wrong to brush it off, as Sturm did (and as you are doing) as negligible.
                        Um see 2016, Wittens YAC was twice as good. He had just as many 20+ yard receptions as many other seasons in his career. And who was Wittens QB that season?

                        But I know, it doesn't fit your agenda that everything is Daks fault. Must be that 36 fucking year old TEs are game breakers because that can somehow justify your dislike of Dak.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by mschmidt64 View Post
                          And you also can't brush off the QB change when these struggles obviously coincide with it, and that he did in fact get downfield occasionally still.

                          It seems extremely unlikely to me that the two have zero to do with each other. I am not saying to what extent is which, but I think it's wrong to brush it off, as Sturm did (and as you are doing) as negligible.
                          Um see 2016, Wittens YAC was twice as good. He had just as many 20+ yard receptions as many other seasons in his career. And who was Wittens QB that season?

                          But I know, it doesn't fit your agenda that everything is Daks fault. Must be that 36 fucking year old TEs are game breakers because that can somehow justify your dislike of Dak.

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                          • #28
                            1.6 yards after catch average. Hell Witten could get that falling down. I'm not even sure how that embarrassing statistic is someone else's fault besides Witten.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Cowboysrock55 View Post
                              Um see 2016, Wittens YAC was twice as good. He had just as many 20+ yard receptions as many other seasons in his career. And who was Wittens QB that season?

                              But I know, it doesn't fit your agenda that everything is Daks fault. Must be that 36 fucking year old TEs are game breakers because that can somehow justify your dislike of Dak.
                              Dak was much better that season and regressed this season.

                              And when have I ever been someone who says "everything is Dak's fault"? I like Dak.

                              I just don't think he's teflon or a proven franchise QB yet.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Cowboysrock55 View Post
                                1.6 yards after catch average. Hell Witten could get that falling down. I'm not even sure how that embarrassing statistic is someone else's fault besides Witten.
                                That's not the stat we are talking about, dummy. No one is blaming Witten's YAC on Dak.

                                We're talking about downfield targets. The two are different and NOT ENTIRELY RELATED.

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