2019 Draft Chatter Thread...

[NoDak]

Yeah, but we didn't know at the time that 2009 was all timer bad.

Jason X Williams was a LB that was drafted about a round or two too high. But we all bought into "But he's athletic and raw and developmental and even though he's a reach he's still a very good prospect." Reminds me a lot of the Hill pick in retrospect (though I think Hill is a better prospect; I'm just saying the rationale sounds familiar with why we reached).

Butler, Williams, Hamlin, DeAngelo Smith, all were kinda middling draft stock guys that had some trait that gave you a reason to think they might stick. I get very much that same vibe from Pollard-Jackson-Jackson.

And Wilson-Weber-Jelks strikes me as maybe a BIT better than training camp fodder like Hodge-Mickens-Johnson but not THAT much better. Wilson is a nothing. Jelks is a huge projection with a long way to go. Weber is a guy like Scarborough or Jackson, COULD be ok, but no guarantee they are anything more than like Rod Smith either.

Feels like it was really a "depth" draft. We drafted for backups, and backups are what we're gonna get.

Yeah, I don't agree. Not even a little bit.

I would be shocked if McGovern isn't a starter in this league. And even though I was one of the guys that wanted Thornhill drafted, I also believe there is a very, very good chance for Hill to be a long term starter. As for the other guys, you never know. Just like in any other draft.

 

[boozeman]

Yeah, but we didn't know at the time that 2009 was all timer bad.

Bullshit. If you felt good about that draft even then you were a flaming homer.

Each and every pick was worse than the other. It started with Jason Williams, then Robert Brewster, then Stephen McGee and it didn't stop. Trade down after trade down. Stockpiling shitty low round pick after shitty low round pick thinking that they could get more bang for the buck the more low rent choices they accumulated.

It got to a point when you had to look and find hope with guys like Victor Butler.

Jason X Williams was a LB that was drafted about a round or two too high. But we all bought into "But he's athletic and raw and developmental and even though he's a reach he's still a very good prospect." Reminds me a lot of the Hill pick in retrospect (though I think Hill is a better prospect; I'm just saying the rationale sounds familiar with why we reached).

Butler, Williams, Hamlin, DeAngelo Smith, all were kinda middling draft stock guys that had some trait that gave you a reason to think they might stick. I get very much that same vibe from Pollard-Jackson-Jackson.

And Wilson-Weber-Jelks strikes me as maybe a BIT better than training camp fodder like Hodge-Mickens-Johnson but not THAT much better. Wilson is a nothing. Jelks is a huge projection with a long way to go. Weber is a guy like Scarborough or Jackson, COULD be ok, but no guarantee they are anything more than like Rod Smith either.

Feels like it was really a "depth" draft. We drafted for backups, and backups are what we're gonna get.

The fact that you equate the two is frightening. Even I don't think this year's is that bad.

But there are parallels.

 

[boozeman]

Yeah, I don't agree. Not even a little bit.

I would be shocked if McGovern isn't a starter in this league. And even though I was one of the guys that wanted Thornhill drafted, I also believe there is a very, very good chance for Hill to be a long term starter. As for the other guys, you never know. Just like in any other draft.

I feel pretty much the same.

Hill? We better be right.

McGovern? I think we may have done the simplest thing and then it pays off. Much harder to whiff on top OL.

As for the others, part of what you said is correct. It is a gamble on traits.

The Pollard pick is huge, it provided the springboard for the rest of the draft.

If they missed on that, then all the panicked trade downs after we missed out on other guys we wanted was for nothing.

 

[boozeman]

Wrote about our rivals...

https://cowboyswire.usatoday.com/2019/04/29/dallas-cowboys-new-york-giants-philadelphia-eagles-washington-redskins-nfc-east-2019-nfl-draft/

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Bullshit. If you felt good about that draft even then you were a flaming homer.

Each and every pick was worse than the other. It started with Jason Williams, then Robert Brewster, then Stephen McGee and it didn't stop. Trade down after trade down. Stockpiling shitty low round pick after shitty low round pick thinking that they could get more bang for the buck the more low rent choices they accumulated.

It got to a point when you had to look and find hope with guys like Victor Butler.



The fact that you equate the two is frightening. Even I don't think this year's is that bad.

But there are parallels.

I do not like the Hill pick at all but he isn't Jason Williams out of like Western Illinois. None of us even knew who the fuck that guy was. Dude wasn't even good enough to get a combine invite.

 

[boozeman]

I do not like the Hill pick at all but he isn't Jason Williams out of like Western Illinois. None of us even knew who the fuck that guy was. Dude wasn't even good enough to get a combine invite.

That wasn't what I was getting at. I wrote an article about it, should come out tomorrow.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

That wasn't what I was getting at. I wrote an article about it, should come out tomorrow.

Yeah didn't mean to imply you did. It was more a response to Schmitty.

 

[Smitty]

Yeah, I don't agree. Not even a little bit.

I would be shocked if McGovern isn't a starter in this league. And even though I was one of the guys that wanted Thornhill drafted, I also believe there is a very, very good chance for Hill to be a long term starter. As for the other guys, you never know. Just like in any other draft.

I agree about McGovern.... but I think I feel worse about the other picks than you do. I felt way better about mid and late round picks such as Anthony Brown, Xavier Woods, Ryan Switzer, etc.

I don’t see any hits that I feel good about late. As you say, they are all kinda wait and sees I guess, but we don’t usually end up nailing those types.

 

[Smitty]

The parallel with Jason Williams isn’t talent. I agree Hill is better.

The parallel is that it it was kind of an off the board selection about a round or more too high, and it was a player there were serious questions about, who had athletic traits that we are hoping translate, but is raw or something else that might keep him from working out.

Hill isn’t some sure thing. He’s a big risk. He could completely whiff. I am much more uncertain with this pick than like, Chido or Connor Williams.

 

[p1_]

 

[Cowboysrock55]

Yeah I totally believe this. It's why we showed zero interest in the guy but took him. Sometimes a guy is just too good to pass up. I know Kiper had him as like his second or third best guard in the entire draft. The nice thing about Olineman is you have 5 starters and you can usually rearrange players to get the best ones on the field.

I love the pick even though I never saw it coming.

 

[Cowboysrock55]

I agree about McGovern.... but I think I feel worse about the other picks than you do. I felt way better about mid and late round picks such as Anthony Brown, Xavier Woods, Ryan Switzer, etc.

Pollard is basically Switzer. Sooo you probably shouldn't have felt good about Switzer.

I agree on there not being an Xavier Woods in this draft. I really like Mike Weber but not as much as I did Xavier Woods. More than Anyhony Brown though. Joe Jackson was really good value where we got him. Not sure why you don't think Michael Jackson is in the same class as Anthony Brown. He was a better college player than Brown was. They both have length and great speed.

 

[boozeman]

That is a quote worth saving.

Sounds to me that they overvalued the kid.

I won't lie and say there was no interest there, but you can read any article leading up to the draft on him from any market. We were hotter for him than most.

 

[Simpleton]

The parallel with Jason Williams isn’t talent. I agree Hill is better.

The parallel is that it it was kind of an off the board selection about a round or more too high, and it was a player there were serious questions about, who had athletic traits that we are hoping translate, but is raw or something else that might keep him from working out.

Hill isn’t some sure thing. He’s a big risk. He could completely whiff. I am much more uncertain with this pick than like, Chido or Connor Williams.

I feel really good about Joe Jackson, he easily could've been a late 3rd. The only thing he's missing is elite burst but he's very physical, very strong hands, he's relentless and put up some big time production at Miami. I like him better than I liked Dorance Armstrong and I'd be shocked if he didn't end up as a solid rotational piece.

 

[Simpleton]

Didn't Memphis absolutely gash them on the ground?

I'd argue Dre'mont Jones had more impressive games. He played awesome in the Big 10 championship game.

They did, yes, although most of their scoring was in the first half, they put up 38 in the 1st and 3 in the 2nd. I liked Jones better than Hill, so yea, maybe he did have better games, but this Hill game was definitely one of the best I've seen out of any prospect in a single game.

 

[NoDak]

I feel really good about Joe Jackson, he easily could've been a late 3rd. The only thing he's missing is elite burst but he's very physical, very strong hands, he's relentless and put up some big time production at Miami. I like him better than I liked Dorance Armstrong and I'd be shocked if he didn't end up as a solid rotational piece.

I really like him, too. I mentioned him a while back as one of the guys I wouldn't mind us coming away with on draft weekend.

 

[Simpleton]

I really like him, too. I mentioned him a while back as one of the guys I wouldn't mind us coming away with on draft weekend.

He's going to be a guy who makes it easier to get rid of Crawford in a year or two.

 

[Smitty]

I feel really good about Joe Jackson, he easily could've been a late 3rd. The only thing he's missing is elite burst but he's very physical, very strong hands, he's relentless and put up some big time production at Miami. I like him better than I liked Dorance Armstrong and I'd be shocked if he didn't end up as a solid rotational piece.

Maybe.... I feel like we say every year "We got so and so in the 5th and he could've been a late third."

But there was no real buzz about Jackson being a Day 2 pick as far as I can tell -- again, not that I really did much research.

I am just saying, I don't have a great feeling. If Hill is good, McGovern is good, Joe Jackson is really a Day 2 guy, Mike Jackson is Anthony Brown, Pollard is Kamara, Weber is a solid backup bell cow, Jelks was a steal, etc, well, then why do we all have a bad feeling about this draft? If all those outcomes were likely, this would be like 2016 lite.

It's way more like 2009. Most of these guys have the potential you are identifying, but I'm guessing their chances of reaching it are way worse than our average drafts in recent years.

 

[Smitty]

Also, not that this is the be-all, end-all, but obviously it's how we are all evaluating (ie, immediately), but the consensus is pretty much that our draft was among the worst.

So I'm just not buying the hype around the Jacksons, Pollard, that Hill is truly a worthy 2nd round talent, etc.

I think we reached. A lot. And I have a bad feeling that this draft is gonna be left really lacking in comparison to the last 5 years or so of our drafting.

 

[p1_]