Sturm: Dissecting the Cowboys - Understanding 4-year conveyor belt of NFL roster building

ZeroClub

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Then explain Stafford. Foles. Eli Manning. Flacco. All QBs that were said were to be not good enough. They won super bowls in this era.

They had good teams around them. And they were good enough to win. And so can Dak.
I couldn't agree more.

What's encouraging is that the Cowboys are building their team so that they can have a shot with a good-enough-to-win QB. I'm hopeful that McCarthy knows what he has in Dak and won't ask him to do too much. The team seems prepared to lean on its defense.

I think it takes some degree of luck for any team to win the Super Bowl. Things have to fall into place. Key injuries have to be avoided or fortuitously timed. Generally a couple of low probability plays (and bad calls) have to go your way. And so on. That's what parity does to the game.
 

Foobio

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This article just highlights how fuckin awful the Poonmaker pick was. This team needed that pick to be a starter at just about any other position.
 

ravidubey

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I'd even throw Matt Ryan in there, he's about the same caliber of QB as Dak and more or less won a Super Bowl if not for a once in a lifetime fluke comeback/set of circumstances.
There is no more or less winning

There is only winning

All he has to do is score at all during the Pats comeback-- even just possess the ball-- and they win.

It can be argued he's most responsible for the choke.
 

Simpleton

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There is no more or less winning

There is only winning

All he has to do is score at all during the Pats comeback-- even just possess the ball-- and they win.

It can be argued he's most responsible for the choke.
In terms of this conversation and talking about what an above average to good but not great QB can do relative to winning a Super Bowl, Ryan is relevant. That game was lost by their defense and primarily Shannahan for being a moron with his situational play-calling.
 

ravidubey

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In terms of this conversation and talking about what an above average to good but not great QB can do relative to winning a Super Bowl, Ryan is relevant. That game was lost by their defense and primarily Shannahan for being a moron with his situational play-calling.
One QB stepped up and started applying pressure while the other failed to respond.

This is the modern NFL where we’ve seen some crazy comebacks once defenses go soft. That defense stymied Brady for most of three quarters, and that’s hard to do. We’ve seen him come back vs the best defenses time and again.

When the comeback started and everyone was tired with it easy to imagine the lead was safe— is when leaders step up. Ryan in position to win at about the 20 up 28-20 with 4 minutes to play, lackadaisically took a horrible sack when he absolutely could not afford to take one.

That more than any other single play lost the game. A quick throwaway at someone’s feet probably results in a game-winning FG. Instead the next play is a hold that ends any FG chance whatsoever.

That presence of mind is huge, and Ryan didn’t execute. Also, the faces of the Falcon players to a man besides Jones showed a nervous uncertainty. Brady meanwhile was visibly and emotionally charged on the sidelines.

The difference between Ryan who had ridden Julio Jones and his defense to that point and Brady was never more stark than on that play.
 

ravidubey

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I do agree that this is an especially important year for Dak. It'll be a challenge for the team to learn and run a new offense. Dak needs to rise to that challenge.
It absolutely is. Getting hurt and leading the NFL in interceptions in just 12 games were real steps sideways for him.

At age 29 with some injuries, he's not the same physically strong player he was during his early career.

The big thing though is helping the team weather storms in the playoffs. Even if it's a storm he caused with interceptions, you've got to adjust personally and be a step faster.

I'm hoping the new offense bears this notion of speed in mind-- we need some rhythm plays that require a fast decision when momentum is not swinging our way. These slow-developing runs and deep curls have to go!
 

UncleMilti

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You have to have the cap space to try. Even a broken clock is right twice a day. Maybe they get it right eventually. I think they've finally learned not to pay RB's QB money. That's something, right?

But with Dak poised to soak up 45-50 million a year, we're left hoping to draft star players in every round. That's unsustainable if the QB can't make up for deficiencies at various positions.
Unfortunately the NFL is more like what the Eagles are and have done and much less like what the Cowboys do.
The Jones’ aren’t going to cut away from Dak nor draft a QB anytime soon which rots away the core of the star players we have. As we wait on Dak to “improve” the core talent ages, moves on, or gets injured.
That 4-5 year window is how a team needs to be constructed, but our brain trust doesn’t believe in it. So we are always missing it by just THAT much.
 

ravidubey

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Unfortunately the NFL is more like what the Eagles are and have done and much less like what the Cowboys do.
The Jones’ aren’t going to cut away from Dak nor draft a QB anytime soon which rots away the core of the star players we have. As we wait on Dak to “improve” the core talent ages, moves on, or gets injured.
That 4-5 year window is how a team needs to be constructed, but our brain trust doesn’t believe in it. So we are always missing it by just THAT much.
All true.

And as we strengthen some areas, other key areas decline, get injured, or get traded away in a hissy fit.

Football whack-a-mole doesn’t work. You have to have a plan, and if your QB can’t get you over the hump, you have to create an exit strategy

Instead, we keep doubling down on the same guy and don’t even think about a succession plan.

The Eagles leapfrogged us last year at least in part because they recognized Wentz wasn’t the solution, drafted Hurts while they still had Wentz, and were able to trade Wentz for real draft capital.

That took guts and it got them to another Superbowl. I just thank God and Pat Mahomes they didn’t win.
 

son of deadrise

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There is no more or less winning

There is only winning

All he has to do is score at all during the Pats comeback-- even just possess the ball-- and they win.

It can be argued he's most responsible for the choke.
The difference between Dak and Ryan being that Ryan at least got INTO the NFCC game and his team won. And then INTO the SB. If he choked, OK, but he and his team got close. MUCH closer that Dak has been since 2016 and light years closer than Jerry's clown show has been in 30 years.

The point is not really Dak. It's the whole approach. Jerry will hang onto Dak for the foreseeable future. He'll be good, but not good enough. And Jerry will never understand that.
 

son of deadrise

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All true.

And as we strengthen some areas, other key areas decline, get injured, or get traded away in a hissy fit.

Football whack-a-mole doesn’t work. You have to have a plan, and if your QB can’t get you over the hump, you have to create an exit strategy

Instead, we keep doubling down on the same guy and don’t even think about a succession plan.

The Eagles leapfrogged us last year at least in part because they recognized Wentz wasn’t the solution, drafted Hurts while they still had Wentz, and were able to trade Wentz for real draft capital.

That took guts and it got them to another Superbowl. I just thank God and Pat Mahomes they didn’t win.
The Eagles ate a big portion of Wentz's contract in order to make that trade work. Think Jerry would ever even consider anything like that? If Jerry had drafted Wentz, Wentz would still be his QB.
 

p1_

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The Eagles ate a big portion of Wentz's contract in order to make that trade work. Think Jerry would ever even consider anything like that? If Jerry had drafted Wentz, Wentz would still be his QB.
Hate the Eagles all you like, Roseman is a real GM who gets it.
 

son of deadrise

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One QB stepped up and started applying pressure while the other failed to respond.

This is the modern NFL where we’ve seen some crazy comebacks once defenses go soft. That defense stymied Brady for most of three quarters, and that’s hard to do. We’ve seen him come back vs the best defenses time and again.

When the comeback started and everyone was tired with it easy to imagine the lead was safe— is when leaders step up. Ryan in position to win at about the 20 up 28-20 with 4 minutes to play, lackadaisically took a horrible sack when he absolutely could not afford to take one.

That more than any other single play lost the game. A quick throwaway at someone’s feet probably results in a game-winning FG. Instead the next play is a hold that ends any FG chance whatsoever.

That presence of mind is huge, and Ryan didn’t execute. Also, the faces of the Falcon players to a man besides Jones showed a nervous uncertainty. Brady meanwhile was visibly and emotionally charged on the sidelines.

The difference between Ryan who had ridden Julio Jones and his defense to that point and Brady was never more stark than on that play.
But at least Ryan got past the NFCC game and into the SB. More than Dak's ever come close to.
 

son of deadrise

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All true.

And as we strengthen some areas, other key areas decline, get injured, or get traded away in a hissy fit.

Football whack-a-mole doesn’t work. You have to have a plan, and if your QB can’t get you over the hump, you have to create an exit strategy

Instead, we keep doubling down on the same guy and don’t even think about a succession plan.

The Eagles leapfrogged us last year at least in part because they recognized Wentz wasn’t the solution, drafted Hurts while they still had Wentz, and were able to trade Wentz for real draft capital.

That took guts and it got them to another Superbowl. I just thank God and Pat Mahomes they didn’t win.
Philly drafted Hurst while they still had Wentz. KC drafted Mahomes while they still had Alex Smith. GB drafted Rodgers while they still had Farve. Josh Allen wasn't the designated starter in Buffalo at the beginning of his first season. Anybody see a pattern here?
 

Cowboysrock55

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Philly drafted Hurst while they still had Wentz. KC drafted Mahomes while they still had Alex Smith. GB drafted Rodgers while they still had Farve. Josh Allen wasn't the designated starter in Buffalo at the beginning of his first season. Anybody see a pattern here?
Dak is better than Wentz and Smith, that's kind of the difference. Favres career was over by that point. That's like pointing out we drafted Dak while we still had Romo.
 
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son of deadrise

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Dak is better than Wentz and Smith, that's kind of the difference. Favres career was over by that point. That's like pointing out we drafted Dak while we still had Romo.
Dak was a 4th round pick. An afterthought. Hurts was a 2nd, Rodgers, Allen and Mahomes were 1st rounders. The point being that those teams were looking ahead, knowing that what they had was not going to cut it for long. Churn and burn. Out with old, in with the new. Something the good organizations are doing, but is totally beyond Dumb and Dumber's comprehension.
 

Cowboysrock55

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Dak was a 4th round pick. An afterthought. Hurts was a 2nd, Rodgers, Allen and Mahomes were 1st rounders. The point being that those teams were looking ahead, knowing that what they had was not going to cut it for long. Churn and burn. Out with old, in with the new. Something the good organizations are doing, but is totally beyond Dumb and Dumber's comprehension.
Sure and the same year we took Dak we tried to trade into the first for a QB (Who was a big bust).
 
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