Armed Protesters Inspired By LDS Scripture

Jiggyfly

Banned
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
9,220
REPORTS: ARMED PROTESTORS INSPIRED BY LDS SCRIPTURE
NATIONAL 0 Updated at 7:47 pm, January 5th, 2016 By: Dan Simon and Holly Yan, CNN Newswire
SHARE THIS STORY

(CNN) — Nearly two years before armed protesters took over a federal building in Oregon, a similar fight was waged in Nevada. And the organizers of both have the same last name: Bundy.

Ammon Bundy, 40, is leading the group that has taken over a federal refuge center in Oregon. He is the son of Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy, 67, who engaged in a protracted battled with the federal Bureau of Land Management over grazing rights for his cattle.

The Bundys drew national attention in 2014 for refusing to pay the federal government more than $1 million in grazing fees.

“I not only said no. I said hell no,” Cliven Bundy told CNN at the time over his refusal to relocate his cattle.

The land in Clark County, Nevada, became federally protected in 1989 after the government declared the Mojave Desert tortoise an endangered species. That effectively put an end to livestock grazing there.

Most ranchers left. The Bundys stayed and continued raising their cattle but racked up more than $1 million in fees and fines. Their refusal to foot the bill eventually drew the ire of federal agents, who seized a portion of their cattle.

Armed militiamen, angered at what they believed to be government overreach, soon converged near the Bundys’ Nevada ranch.

“It’s no different than Mexican cartels telling you you have to pay money to stay on your own property,” Bundy supporter Paul Lindsey said at the time. “It’s the same thing.”

Faced with the prospect of a bloody confrontation, the Bureau of Land Management released the cattle, ending a tense standoff.

A spiritual calling

Cliven Bundy, a Mormon, has said his standoff with the bureau was a spiritual calling.

In August 2014, he cited his faith in a speech to members of the socially conservative Independent American Party in St. George, Utah.

“The Lord told me … if (the sheriff doesn’t) take away these arms (from federal agents), we the people will have to face these arms in a civil war. He said, ‘This is your chance to straighten this thing up,’ ” Bundy said, according to The Spectrum.

But a top spokesman for the Mormon church denounced the current armed occupation of the Oregon refuge.

“Church leaders strongly condemn the armed seizure of the facility and are deeply troubled by the reports that those who have seized the facility suggest that they are doing so based on scriptural principles,” said Eric Hawkins, spokesman for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

“This armed occupation can in no way be justified on a scriptural basis.”

Cliven Bundy: ‘Are they better off as slaves?’

To some, Cliven Bundy had been a conservative hero for his steadfast position against the government. But the rancher damaged his credibility with mainstream supporters by making what many perceived to be racist statements.

Wading into social issues, Bundy openly speculated whether African-Americans would be better off as slaves.

“I’ve often wondered, are they better off as slaves, picking cotton and having a family life and doing things, or are they better off under government subsidy? They didn’t get no more freedom. They got less freedom,” he said.

Ammon Bundy: I’ve been treated like a terrorist

Before helping take over the federal building in Oregon, Ammon Bundy has said he’s been labeled and treated as a terrorist.

In 2014, then-Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said those who defended Cliven Bundy at the Nevada standoff were “domestic terrorists.”

“I have never been charged and prosecuted with anything in my life, and yet Senator Reid, without due process, has declared me, for life, as a Domestic Terrorist,” Ammon Bundy wrote in a November 2014 piece for Infowars.

And he said that label has affected his life.

He described trying to get on a flight with his 12-year-old daughter to attend “a special event of a loved one.” But his ticket read “SSSS” — which stands for secondary security screening selection.

He said he went through an hour of additional security checks, which caused him and his daughter to miss their flight.

“This incident reaffirmed to me the danger that the American people are in,” he wrote. “When a very small group of elitists use the peoples power without authority, and are willing to destroy the lives of those who disagree or stand up to them, when this type of unlimited power is commonly exercised without checks and balances the people are in danger.”
 
Last edited:

Jiggyfly

Banned
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
9,220
Meet the cast of colorful characters in the Oregon standoff

Molly Hennessy-Fiske Molly Hennessy-FiskeContact Reporter

The armed occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in southeastern Oregon, which started over the weekend as a demonstration in support of two local ranchers facing federal imprisonment, has a cast of colorful characters from across the West. Some have holed up inside the refuge, and others have been standing guard, delivering supplies and protesting outside. A few of the more prominent figures:


Ammon and Ryan Bundy


The brothers leading the occupation are among the 14 children of Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy, who led a weeks-long armed standoff over federal grazing fees in 2014.

"It's up to us, We the People, to restore and defend the Constitution," Ammon Bundy, 40, who ran a valet car service in Phoenix before recently moving to Idaho, tweeted Monday.

His brother Ryan, 43, runs a construction company in Cedar City, Utah. The local ranchers' case, he told NBC News, is "an example of the terrorism that the federal government is placing upon the people."

The Bundys, like other participants in the Oregon occupation, appear to be driven in part by their Mormon religious beliefs. In a video posted New Year's Day, Ammon Bundy defended the occupation as a "righteous cause" that he and others were obligated to take on.

"I began to understand how the Lord felt about Harney County and about this country, and I clearly understood that the Lord was not pleased," he said.

Said Ryan Bundy: "We're trying to accomplish the task of restoring rights to the people who have lost them or surrendered them."

Captain Moroni

Guarding the refuge entrance has been a man in a gray camouflage winter coat who has identified himself to reporters only as Captain Moroni from Utah — another Mormon reference.

According to Mormon beliefs, Moroni was an ancient insurrectionist leader who inspired an army of followers to confront a corrupt king by turning his coat into a flag and raising it as a "title of liberty."

"And it came to pass that Moroni was angry with the government, because of their indifference concerning the freedom of their country," the scripture says. The king ultimately fled.

When Ammon Bundy called for "fellow patriots" to join him in the occupation, the Utah volunteer said he felt a religious obligation, especially because Bundy's call echoes what Moroni told his followers, according to Mormon scripture.

"I just knew it was the right thing," he told OPB News. "I'm willing to die here."


Jon Ritzheimer


A retired Marine from Phoenix, Ritzheimer has led various armed rallies in Arizona against Muslims and drew the attention of law enforcement last month after he drove cross-country to confront residents of a Muslim enclave in upstate New York.

In a video about the Oregon occupation posted online Sunday, Ritzheimer appears holding a copy of the Constitution saying: "We need to stand our ground together. If we don't stand our ground together, that's when we fall."

Ritzheimer in a second video criticizes the federal Bureau of Land Management: "The kids that have never had their hands dirty, and now they get these jobs at the BLM, and now they're going to tell these ranchers, these people who are more in tune with the ground and with the earth out here, they're going to come out here and tell them how to run their show, how to ranch, how many head of cattle they can have, where they can go, where they can't go on their own damn land."

Toward the end of the video, Ritzheimer calls on others to join the occupation. "We need real men here," he said. "Americans who have the intestinal fortitude to come here and take a stand and say enough is enough."


Ryan Payne

The Montana electrician and Army veteran is among those in the occupied refuge and has boasted to the press of organizing civilians into sniper squads to confront federal agents at the Cliven Bundy ranch in Nevada in 2014.

"We had counter-sniper positions on their sniper positions. We had at least one guy, sometimes two guys, per BLM agent in there," Payne told the Missoula Independent weekly newspaper in Montana. "If they made one wrong move, every single BLM agent in that camp would've died."

Payne has been a constant presence near the refuge in recent weeks and told the Oregonian newspaper that he was determined to take a stand on behalf of locals. "We're sending the message: We will protect you," Payne said.


Richard Mack

Mack has been among those protesting in support of the ranchers now serving time on a federal arson charge, but has not been one of those occupying a federal building in the refuge. Mack, former sheriff of Graham County, Ariz., is best known as a plaintiff in a lawsuit against the federal government alleging that portions of the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act violated the Constitution. A former lobbyist for Gun Owners of America, Mack also founded the Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Assn., which claims the right to refuse to enforce federal laws.

Mack met Saturday with the ranchers, Dwight Hammond, 73, and his son Steven Hammond, 46. He then blogged about his experience in Oregon, noting he and his group did not support the occupation.

"This is about our country, our liberty and our sacred Constitution. This is about federal agents who have done the same thing the Hammonds have been charged with and for which they have received no punishment whatsoever," he wrote.

Mack called for an end to the occupation, saying, "Local officials, including the Harney County sheriff, are still working for a peaceful resolution on the Hammonds' behalf. We will continue to work and pray for its success."
 

Cotton

One-armed Knife Sharpener
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
119,696
:unsure

So you think what they did makes them a treasonist? Doesn't really seem to fit the definition of treason.
I think it was a pretty shitty thing the gov't did. I mean the man is using his own land to try to make a living and the gov't swoops in and tells him he can't use his own land how he wants? BS.
 

Jiggyfly

Banned
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
9,220
I think it was a pretty shitty thing the gov't did. I mean the man is using his own land to try to make a living and the gov't swoops in and tells him he can't use his own land how he wants? BS.
There is some debate if that is his own land from what I read.

And even the people going to jail don't agree with these guys.
 

Cowboysrock55

Super Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
52,453
I think it was a pretty shitty thing the gov't did. I mean the man is using his own land to try to make a living and the gov't swoops in and tells him he can't use his own land how he wants? BS.
Yeah I have a serious problem with that part of it. Just a great example of bullshit over the top regulation.
 

Cotton

One-armed Knife Sharpener
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
119,696
There is some debate if that is his own land from what I read.

And even the people going to jail don't agree with these guys.
Whose land is it if it isn't his?
 

townsend

Banned
Joined
Apr 11, 2013
Messages
5,377
:unsure

So you think what they did makes them a treasonist? Doesn't really seem to fit the definition of treason.
any armed militia who raises arms against their government is committing treason. That seems pretty cut and dried to me.
 

VA Cowboy

Brand New Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
4,710
Ammon Bundy’s father, Cliven Bundy, told Oregon Public Broadcasting Saturday night that he had nothing to do with the takeover of the building.

Bundy said his son felt obligated to intervene on behalf of the Hammonds.

“That’s not exactly what I thought should happen, but I didn’t know what to do,” he said. “You know, if the Hammonds wouldn’t stand, if the sheriff didn’t stand, then, you know, the people had to do something. And I guess this is what they did decide to do. I wasn’t in on that.”
Sounds like Bundy jr just wants a confrontation. I'm all for peaceful protests, defending against gov't over-reach, etc. But Jr. is just intervening on a situation that doesn't even involve him.
 

Cotton

One-armed Knife Sharpener
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
119,696
Who are we talking about the guy that set fire?
No, that's a different group. This one had the gov't declare his land as federally protected because of some fucking frog or something that was reclassified as endangered and as part of that declaration they said he couldn't graze his cattle on his own land without paying fees to the gov't. He refused to pay the fees, so no the gov't is taking action against him.
 

Jiggyfly

Banned
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
9,220
No, that's a different group. This one had the gov't declare his land as federally protected because of some fucking frog or something that was reclassified as endangered and as part of that declaration they said he couldn't graze his cattle on his own land without paying fees to the gov't. He refused to pay the fees, so no the gov't is taking action against him.
Clive Bundy?

I don't think you have all the pertinenet facts. It was never his land.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bundy_standoff
The land to which Cliven Bundy claims ancestral rights was originally inhabited by the Moapa Paiute people.[22] In 1848, as part of the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, the United States purchased from Mexico land that is now the southwestern region of the United States. Since then, the government has continuously owned land in what is now Nevada, including the Bunkerville Allotment.[3][23] The Nevada Territory, which was partitioned in 1861 from the Utah Territory, became a state in 1864. The original settlers in the 1840s and 1850s were Mormons from Utah and southern small-time farmers and ranchers from Louisiana, Arkansas, and Mississippi. After the end of the American Civil War, much of the land was settled by rural farmers, squatters and small-time cattle ranchers from Oklahoma, Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana, Missouri and Kansas, escaping from the post-Civil War Reconstruction and the associated violence and displacement.[citation needed]

Since 1934 federal rangelands in Nevada have been managed principally by either the Bureau of Land Management or its predecessor, the United States Grazing Service, or the United States Forest Service. As of 2010, 47.8 million acres[24] (more than two-thirds of Nevada's 70.3 million acres) were managed by the BLM. Throughout the nation, the BLM manages nearly 18,000 grazing permits and leases,[25] of which about 700 are in Nevada.[26] The season of use and the details of forage are stipulated in permits and leases; thus federal control can be exerted on the land used for grazing.[25]
And it seems he used to have no problems with paying fees.
Under Bureau of Land Management permits first issued in 1954, Bundy grazed his cattle legally and paid his grazing fees on the Bunkerville Allotment until 1993. In that year, as a protest, Bundy did not pay to renew his permit, and it was canceled in 1994.
Maybe you are talking about somebody else but I see nothing about a frog and taking his land.
 

Cotton

One-armed Knife Sharpener
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
119,696
Christ, man, it was in the article YOU posted.



Ammon Bundy, 40, is leading the group that has taken over a federal refuge center in Oregon. He is the son of Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy, 67, who engaged in a protracted battled with the federal Bureau of Land Management over grazing rights for his cattle.

The Bundys drew national attention in 2014 for refusing to pay the federal government more than $1 million in grazing fees.

“I not only said no. I said hell no,” Cliven Bundy told CNN at the time over his refusal to relocate his cattle.

The land in Clark County, Nevada, became federally protected in 1989 after the government declared the Mojave Desert tortoise an endangered species. That effectively put an end to livestock grazing there.

Most ranchers left. The Bundys stayed and continued raising their cattle but racked up more than $1 million in fees and fines. Their refusal to foot the bill eventually drew the ire of federal agents, who seized a portion of their cattle.
 

Jiggyfly

Banned
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
9,220
Christ, man, it was in the article YOU posted.



Ammon Bundy, 40, is leading the group that has taken over a federal refuge center in Oregon. He is the son of Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy, 67, who engaged in a protracted battled with the federal Bureau of Land Management over grazing rights for his cattle.

The Bundys drew national attention in 2014 for refusing to pay the federal government more than $1 million in grazing fees.

“I not only said no. I said hell no,” Cliven Bundy told CNN at the time over his refusal to relocate his cattle.

The land in Clark County, Nevada, became federally protected in 1989 after the government declared the Mojave Desert tortoise an endangered species. That effectively put an end to livestock grazing there.

Most ranchers left. The Bundys stayed and continued raising their cattle but racked up more than $1 million in fees and fines. Their refusal to foot the bill eventually drew the ire of federal agents, who seized a portion of their cattle.
The article never says it was his land it says they had grazing rights which were from the federal government, the article is
confusing because even they say they kept grazing there so how could grazing be ended and they still racked up grazing fees?
 

Cotton

One-armed Knife Sharpener
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
119,696
The article never says it was his land it says they had grazing rights which were from the federal government, the article is
confusing because even they say they kept grazing there so how could grazing be ended and they still racked up grazing fees?
The grazing fees happened because the grazing didn't stop. He just refused to pay them. So that crap you posted about 1954 or whatever seems to contradict this account.
 
Top Bottom