NBA Chatter Thread

Carp

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For the first time since the start of the 2014-2015 season, I think the Warriors are genuinely in danger of losing a series.
They just don't value the basketball. When it is all working all the dangerous passes and super long 3s are fun to watch, but it was not working last night. They were a blast last year, but they got a little to big for their britches.
 

Carp

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He was at one point but that ship, any ship that had Rose as the perennial All-Star/MVP candidate that he once was has sailed.

Doesn't have anything to do with this Warriors team not being the greatest of all time/better than that Bulls team/whatever other superlatives that have been thrown around about them over the last 6 months.
Yeah...this is as fun as debating Emmitt vs Barry.
 

Texas Ace

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They just don't value the basketball. When it is all working all the dangerous passes and super long 3s are fun to watch, but it was not working last night. They were a blast last year, but they got a little to big for their britches.
I still think their best basketball is better than everyone else's, but I just wonder if this is a team that is is able to get back to basics and reevaluate itself. Do they have the composure or even the humility to change how they're playing?

They better, because for the first time in roughly 2 years, I saw them actually looking morally defeated and out of answers. Everyone loses in the playoffs and sometimes you even get your ass handed to you, but something just didn't look right with them last night and I think they are dangerously close to losing their grip on things.

I guess we'll see what kind of character they have in game 4. Lose that one, and it's over.
 
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1bigfan13

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They just don't value the basketball. When it is all working all the dangerous passes and super long 3s are fun to watch, but it was not working last night. They were a blast last year, but they got a little to big for their britches.
Yep. The funny thing is Curry's ability to hit deep 3s has rubbed off on the rest of the guys. I've seen Draymond and a few others take long bad 3s with plenty of time on the shot clock. As an OKC fan I'll gladly take Green and Barnes trying to beat us from deep.
 

Simpleton

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I still think their best basketball is better than everyone else's, but I just wonder if this is a team that is is able to get back to basics and reevaluate itself. Do they have the composure or even the humility to change how they're playing?

They better, because for the first time in roughly 2 years, I saw them actually looking morally defeated and out of answers. Everyone loses in the playoffs and sometimes you even get your ass handed to you, but something just didn't look right with them last night and I think they are dangerously close to losing their grip on things.

I guess we'll see what kind of character they have in game 4. Lose that one, and it's over.
Well to be fair they went through the playoffs last year only having to go through a shit New Orleans team, an injured Memphis and a poor WCF opponent in Houston, relatively speaking, who also had some injuries I believe. Then in the Finals they played Cleveland down Irving and Love.

This year they went through Houston who is obviously a mess, a decent Portland team who actually gave them more of a run than I expected and now that they are finally facing a team with elite talent at full strength for the first time in their last 7 playoff series they are really struggling.
 

Texas Ace

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Yep. The funny thing is Curry's ability to hit deep 3s has rubbed off on the rest of the guys. I've seen Draymond and a few others take long bad 3s with plenty of time on the shot clock. As an OKC fan I'll gladly take Green and Barnes trying to beat us from deep.
Like I just said, they can't completely reinvent themselves overnight so they've got a bit of a tricky situation on hand. However, they can limit the 3's and the poor shot selection and limit the quick possessions to guys like Curry and Thompson.

If they settle down and move the basketball around, they'll be fine. I just wonder if they'll be able to change things up or if they'll have the composure to do so especially since they're under a lot of pressure now. If Draymond gets suspended for game 4, then things are going to be stacked against them and I'd favor OKC to win that game.
 

Texas Ace

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Well to be fair they went through the playoffs last year only having to go through a shit New Orleans team, an injured Memphis and a poor WCF opponent in Houston, relatively speaking, who also had some injuries I believe. Then in the Finals they played Cleveland down Irving and Love.

This year they went through Houston who is obviously a mess, a decent Portland team who actually gave them more of a run than I expected and now that they are finally facing a team with elite talent at full strength for the first time in their last 7 playoff series they are really struggling.
While that's true, they also demolished the league's best teams this year on numerous occasions. They made what everyone thought was the 2nd best team in basketball in the Spurs look bad multiple times. They completely outclassed them. So I don't buy that what's happening now is necessarily a product of them facing real competition for the first time.

I do think OKC deserves credit because as you said, they've got elite talent themselves and they are playing the best basketball they've played since 2012. But there are other underlying issues with Golden State like cockiness and bad habits. It's like the Chip Kelly offense -- it's cool to use 4 seconds on the playclock when you're moving the ball up and down the field, but when you keep going 3 and out and your defense is exhausted by halftime, then that style of play isn't going to work.

That's essentially what's happening to GS. OKC have gotten in their head and it's affecting their play. Because they've been so successful playing that way for the better part of 2 years, it's what they resort to even when logic says they need to slow things down. It basically comes down whether they can change up their game enough to get back into things, and whether they can do in such a short amount of time.
 

Simpleton

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While that's true, they also demolished the league's best teams this year on numerous occasions. They made what everyone thought was the 2nd best team in basketball in the Spurs look bad multiple times. They completely outclassed them. So I don't buy that what's happening now is necessarily a product of them facing real competition for the first time.

I do think OKC deserves credit because as you said, they've got elite talent themselves and they are playing the best basketball they've played since 2012. But there are other underlying issues with Golden State like cockiness and bad habits. It's like the Chip Kelly offense -- it's cool to use 4 seconds on the playclock when you're moving the ball up and down the field, but when you keep going 3 and out and your defense is exhausted by halftime, then that style of play isn't going to work.

That's essentially what's happening to GS. OKC have gotten in their head and it's affecting their play. Because they've been so successful playing that way for the better part of 2 years, it's what they resort to even when logic says they need to slow things down. It basically comes down whether they can change up their game enough to get back into things, and whether they can do in such a short amount of time.
That is true, the fact that OKC is basically beating them at their own game is very interesting. I think it's because the hyper tempo leads to a bunch of jacked 3's for the Warriors while the Thunder have more explosive ball handlers in Durant and Westbrook who take that hyper tempo and turn them into easy buckets right at the hoop.
 

Jiggyfly

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There has been a lot of pushback about Penny saying the league is watered down, but he is correct.

The top level teams were all deep and had multiple true allstar type players.

Utah
Seattle
Houston
Golden State
Phoenix
Sacramento
New York
Orlando
Atlanta
Cleveland
Charlotte
Miami
and of course
Chicago.

I would give any of those teams a chance at beating whoever wins the Championship this year.


Those teams had stars, veteran savvy and depth and had been together multiple years.
 

Jiggyfly

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Well to be fair they went through the playoffs last year only having to go through a shit New Orleans team, an injured Memphis and a poor WCF opponent in Houston, relatively speaking, who also had some injuries I believe. Then in the Finals they played Cleveland down Irving and Love.

This year they went through Houston who is obviously a mess, a decent Portland team who actually gave them more of a run than I expected and now that they are finally facing a team with elite talent at full strength for the first time in their last 7 playoff series they are really struggling.
Yeah this the 1st real adversity they have faced on this run.
 

Simpleton

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There has been a lot of pushback about Penny saying the league is watered down, but he is correct.

The top level teams were all deep and had multiple true allstar type players.

Utah
Seattle
Houston
Golden State
Phoenix
Sacramento
New York
Orlando
Atlanta
Cleveland
Charlotte
Miami
and of course
Chicago.

I would give any of those teams a chance at beating whoever wins the Championship this year.


Those teams had stars, veteran savvy and depth and had been together multiple years.
Yea, I mean there are only 3 playoff series this year even worth watching, OKC-SA, OKC-GS and the Finals. Every other series involving CLE, SA, OKC or GS against anybody outside of those 4 is completely non-competitive.
 
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Texas Ace

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That is true, the fact that OKC is basically beating them at their own game is very interesting. I think it's because the hyper tempo leads to a bunch of jacked 3's for the Warriors while the Thunder have more explosive ball handlers in Durant and Westbrook who take that hyper tempo and turn them into easy buckets right at the hoop.
And that's a big difference.

When OKC goes on a fastbreak, it's usually ending with Westbrook attacking the basket and either finishing himself or dishing it off to someone else to finish at the rim.

GS has guys who can finish too, so they need to be looking for that more often than always stopping and popping at the 3 point line.
 

Texas Ace

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There has been a lot of pushback about Penny saying the league is watered down, but he is correct.

The top level teams were all deep and had multiple true allstar type players.

Utah
Seattle
Houston
Golden State
Phoenix
Sacramento
New York
Orlando
Atlanta
Cleveland
Charlotte
Miami
and of course
Chicago.

I would give any of those teams a chance at beating whoever wins the Championship this year.


Those teams had stars, veteran savvy and depth and had been together multiple years.
90's basketball will always be my favorite.

Like you said, those teams had legit stars and had chemistry because those teams stayed together for an extended period of time. That's why you had such great playoff series' back then even between teams that weren't necessarily expected to win a championship.

Of course everyone remembers Bulls and Knicks, but Knicks/Pacers, Houston/Seattle, Utah/Houston, Orlando/Indiana, Miami/Knicks etc. all produced heated rivalries and great series'.

We're living in an age of super teams and fast paced basketball and it's created a game that isn't what it used to be. OKC and GS are a dying breed right now in that they're one of the few teams who actually have a core that have stayed together for an extended period.
 

Simpleton

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90's basketball will always be my favorite.

Like you said, those teams had legit stars and had chemistry because those teams stayed together for an extended period of time. That's why you had such great playoff series' back then even between teams that weren't necessarily expected to win a championship.

Of course everyone remembers Bulls and Knicks, but Knicks/Pacers, Houston/Seattle, Utah/Houston, Orlando/Indiana, Miami/Knicks etc. all produced heated rivalries and great series'.

We're living in an age of super teams and fast paced basketball and it's created a game that isn't what it used to be. OKC and GS are a dying breed right now in that they're one of the few teams who actually have a core that have stayed together for an extended period.
The only artificially designed superteam is Cleveland, aside from that GS, OKC and San Antonio are all homegrown, outside of Aldridge.

I think it's just a de-evolution of the game where kids coming into the league haven't developed skills for the most part and are mostly just playing on athleticism since AAU is a joke and nothing more than a showcase for athleticism, and then the best players leave college after just a year so there is no real skill development. Then the extent of coaching these days is basically to just tell players to run, run, run and either drive/kick for a 3 or barrel to the hoop.
 

Cowboysrock55

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The 95-96 Bulls lost one game leading up to the Finals, which included series against the Ewing Knicks and Shaq/Penny Magic, and then lost 2 in the Finals only after going up 3-0, effectively ending the series. Even if the Warriors go on to win it all I think the magnitude of this ass-whipping is enough to say that they aren't better than that Bulls team at the very least.

I realize it's one game and it sounds ridiculous but all-time great teams don't lose by 30+ in the conference finals in a tight series.
Did Jordan get hurt and miss games in those playoffs? Steph Curry is not only the Warriors best player but he is the best player in the NBA. His injury I think has to be accounted for. Even though he is playing, he doesn't look the same right now.
 

1bigfan13

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And that's a big difference.

When OKC goes on a fastbreak, it's usually ending with Westbrook attacking the basket and either finishing himself or dishing it off to someone else to finish at the rim.

GS has guys who can finish too, so they need to be looking for that more often than always stopping and popping at the 3 point line.
It also helps that OKC's small ball lineup consists of two athletic bigs who can move on the perimeter and protect the rim to some degree. You saw it last night. KD at 6'11" and Ibaka at 6'10" smothered most of the Warriors attempts to get to the rim. Durant had a couple of nice blocks on Barnes and Green.
 

1bigfan13

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I also have to give Billy Donovan props for actually making adjustments on the fly. If Scott Brooks weren't so damn stubborn OKC would have probably beat the Heat in 2012. Instead he chose to keep running Kendrick Perkins' worthless ass out there night after night to be exposed.

Donovan on the other hand hasn't been afraid to ditch lineups that aren't working. The Warriors exploited OKC's twin tower lineup in game 2 so last night we played a small ball heavy lineup and limited Kanter's minutes. I love having a coach who has enough common sense to ditch schemes that aren't working.

I expect we'll see some completely different rotations in Game 4 just to keep the Warriors guessing.
 

Simpleton

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Did Jordan get hurt and miss games in those playoffs? Steph Curry is not only the Warriors best player but he is the best player in the NBA. His injury I think has to be accounted for. Even though he is playing, he doesn't look the same right now.
Curry dropped like 20 in OT less than 2 weeks ago, he's fine.

The guy scored 24 in only 30 minutes last night and had 28 in 30 in Game 2, if he was "healthy" would he be scoring 40 or something?
 

Cowboysrock55

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The guy scored 24 in only 30 minutes last night and had 28 in 30 in Game 2, if he was "healthy" would he be scoring 40 or something?
Um in the two losses to OKC he shot 40% and 41% respectively. You know what he shot on the season? 50.4%. So it's not really accurate to say he is playing well up to par. His efficiency numbers are way down. Which could be the lingering impact of the injury or it could just be stellar defense from OKC. Either way, I don't think Jordan was playing through injuries during those playoffs. The Warriors had a regular season that was pretty damn impressive.
 

Simpleton

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Um in the two losses to OKC he shot 40% and 41% respectively. You know what he shot on the season? 50.4%. So it's not really accurate to say he is playing well up to par. His efficiency numbers are way down. Which could be the lingering impact of the injury or it could just be stellar defense from OKC. Either way, I don't think Jordan was playing through injuries during those playoffs. The Warriors had a regular season that was pretty damn impressive.
So what?

He shot 50% or better in their last 2 wins against Portland and in their Game 2 win against OKC. If he had been shooting 30-40% ever since he came back that'd be one thing but he's had a few normal games for him, including the ridiculous OT game against Portland, and a few where he has still scored plenty but not as efficiently as normal.

Seems like a simple case of being outplayed to me.
 
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