Supreme Court rules in favor of same-sex marriage nationwide

townsend · Jul 3, 2015

Enlisted military has been ranked the most difficult job in the US, for as long as I've heard that there were rankings. Sexual assault, suicide, mental health problems, hazing, debilitating injuries are so frequent it's past being a problem and has just sort of become, the way things are.

This of course is all preceded by boot camp, which is a literal, intentional dehumanizing process.

I had it pretty good compared to some, but I had a 2 year stretch where I thought about killing myself every day.

I'm sure it's great for some people, and good for them, but it's a crappy existence for a lot of people.

L.T. Fan · Jul 3, 2015

townsend said:
Enlisted military has been ranked the most difficult job in the US, for as long as I've heard that there were rankings. Sexual assault, suicide, mental health problems, hazing, debilitating injuries are so frequent it's past being a problem and has just sort of become, the way things are.

This of course is all preceded by boot camp, which is a literal, intentional dehumanizing process.

I had it pretty good compared to some, but I had a 2 year stretch where I thought about killing myself every day.

I'm sure it's great for some people, and good for them, but it's a crappy existence for a lot of people.

Sorry to hear about your experience. I didn't view my time including boot camp as being dehumanizing. I saw it as a mental programming process to make an individual become compartmentalized into a system that was completely dependent on everyone without exception following and obeying the orders set forth to achieve a goal or mission. Everyone was connected and dependent on the other to fulfilling those orders.

skidadl · Jul 3, 2015

townsend said:
Enlisted military has been ranked the most difficult job in the US, for as long as I've heard that there were rankings. Sexual assault, suicide, mental health problems, hazing, debilitating injuries are so frequent it's past being a problem and has just sort of become, the way things are.

This of course is all preceded by boot camp, which is a literal, intentional dehumanizing process.

I had it pretty good compared to some, but I had a 2 year stretch where I thought about killing myself every day.

I'm sure it's great for some people, and good for them, but it's a crappy existence for a lot of people.

I think your viewpoint of life and how you were raised makes a huge difference in how you deal with stress.

skidadl · Jul 3, 2015

NoDak said:
Poor kid. He must really feel like an animal.

I raised my kid with the following principals:

1. Don't complain. Be a doer, not a complainer.

2. Respect authority. Always. Unless it is in conflict with your morals (Christian) then find a peaceful way to deal with things. If that doesn't work use force. Like if you have to kick another kid's ass make it the last resort.

3. See everything as an opportunity to learn and be prepared for whatever God has for you next.

4. Do not despise the day of small beginnings.

5. Don't be a pussy.

3.

townsend · Jul 3, 2015

L.T. Fan said:
Sorry to hear about your experience. I didn't view my time including boot camp as being dehumanizing. I saw it as a mental programming process to make an individual become compartmentalized into a system that was completely dependent on everyone without exception following and obeying the orders set forth to achieve a goal or mission. Everyone was connected and dependent on the other to fulfilling those orders.

I mean it was that. But head shaving, sleep deprivation, and chants are also stuff every cult does to break a person's sense of self. It takes away their individual personality. Any circumstance that isn't for the red white and blue, where people pulled that shit, it would and has been seen as unforgivable.

It's something you expect when you enlist, but that doesn't make the phrase "dehumanizing" not apply. It's just that we, as a country, are pretty comfortable with our military going through it.

That being said I survived boot camp easily, it wasn't until my 3rd year in the service (when I went to submarines) that stuff went really bad. It was just two years straight of 80-100 hour work weeks. No sun, no time for any kind of social life, and a lot of getting bitched at. I was in the nuclear program so even the smallest mistakes on the ship threw my entire department in the dog house. There's nothing like being part of an organization that is working you to death, and also calling you a piece of shit for it.

By the time I got off the boat, morale was so low, about a 6th of the crew was taken off the ship due to suicidal ideation or attempts. The command responded by cancelling Christmas stand down. That's pretty much the deal about being enlisted, it's all about the cards you're dealt. If you have enough sociopaths in your CoC, they can literally ruin your life. By the same token, if you work for decent people, you can have the time of your life.

skidadl · Jul 3, 2015

townsend said:
I mean it was that. But head shaving, sleep deprivation, and chants are also stuff every cult does to break a person's sense of self. It takes away their individual personality. Any circumstance that isn't for the red white and blue, where people pulled that shit, it would and has been seen as unforgivable.

It's something you expect when you enlist, but that doesn't make the phrase "dehumanizing" not apply. It's just that we, as a country, are pretty comfortable with our military going through it.

That being said I survived boot camp easily, it wasn't until my 3rd year in the service (when I went to submarines) that stuff went really bad. It was just two years straight of 80-100 hour work weeks. No sun, no time for any kind of social life, and a lot of getting bitched at. I was in the nuclear program so even the smallest mistakes on the ship threw my entire department in the dog house. There's nothing like being part of an organization that is working you to death, and also calling you a piece of shit for it.

By the time I got off the boat, morale was so low, about a 6th of the crew was taken off the ship due to suicidal ideation or attempts. The command responded by cancelling Christmas stand down. That's pretty much the deal about being enlisted, it's all about the cards you're dealt. If you have enough sociopaths in your CoC, they can literally ruin your life. By the same token, if you work for decent people, you can have the time of your life.

I'm sure that it sucked for you. I don't doubt that. I'm assuming that you are living a happy productive life now, no? If not you may wanta move on.

L.T. Fan · Jul 3, 2015

townsend said:
I mean it was that. But head shaving, sleep deprivation, and chants are also stuff every cult does to break a person's sense of self. It takes away their individual personality. Any circumstance that isn't for the red white and blue, where people pulled that shit, it would and has been seen as unforgivable.

It's something you expect when you enlist, but that doesn't make the phrase "dehumanizing" not apply. It's just that we, as a country, are pretty comfortable with our military going through it.

That being said I survived boot camp easily, it wasn't until my 3rd year in the service (when I went to submarines) that stuff went really bad. It was just two years straight of 80-100 hour work weeks. No sun, no time for any kind of social life, and a lot of getting bitched at. I was in the nuclear program so even the smallest mistakes on the ship threw my entire department in the dog house. There's nothing like being part of an organization that is working you to death, and also calling you a piece of shit for it.

By the time I got off the boat, morale was so low, about a 6th of the crew was taken off the ship due to suicidal ideation or attempts. The command responded by cancelling Christmas stand down. That's pretty much the deal about being enlisted, it's all about the cards you're dealt. If you have enough sociopaths in your CoC, they can literally ruin your life. By the same token, if you work for decent people, you can have the time of your life.

During wartime an individual is subject to being captured by the enemy and they will use "dehumanizing" tatics. As to the hair thats simply a matter of ensuring there are no health or bug issues with one's scalp. We had plenty of orentatation regarding what to expect but still it didn't keep a few from climbing a water tower and doing a swan dive. Some simply shouldn't enlist. They cannot deal with the mental conditioning.

dallen · Jul 3, 2015

skidadl said:
I raised my kid with the following principals:

1. Don't complain. Be a doer, not a complainer.

2. Respect authority. Always. Unless it is in conflict with your morals (Christian) then find a peaceful way to deal with things. If that doesn't work use force. Like if you have to kick another kid's ass make it the last resort.

3. See everything as an opportunity to learn and be prepared for whatever God has for you next.

4. Do not despise the day of small beginnings.

5. Don't be a pussy.

3.

Was the 2nd #3 "Always leave room for mystery"?

townsend · Jul 3, 2015

skidadl said:
I think your viewpoint of life and how you were raised makes a huge difference in how you deal with stress.

Depends on the stress. There are a lot of variables. As I said above, my ship had about a half dozen suicide attempts, and about 16 more come off because they were thinking about it. Good vibrations only get you so far.

At the time I got on the boat, I was hyper motivated, and poured myself into the job. Which was what killed me. Optimism and hope can break your fucking heart. In the last few months on board, I would get angrier at myself when I felt this burst of hope, because I knew it would lead to my doing my all, and getting as bunch of misery for it.

If you meet some people in the nuclear navy, you'll find this not uncommon.

I didn't want to kill myself because I was sad. I wanted to kill myself because I was fucking furious. I spent 2 years working myself to death. Because when you're in the military, you're not allowed to say "I've only slept 12 hours this week, I'm going home" I had zero control over anything, and my command treated me as such. When I contemplated suicide, it was the only conceivable situation where I could get some fucking rest.

townsend · Jul 3, 2015

L.T. Fan said:
During wartime an individual is subject to being captured by the enemy and they will use "dehumanizing" tatics. As to the hair thats simply a matter of ensuring there are no health or bug issues with one's scalp. We had plenty of orentatation regarding what to expect but still it didn't keep a few from climbing a water tower and doing a swan dive. Some simply shouldn't enlist. They cannot deal with the mental conditioning.

I would believe the thing about the hair, except they've stopped doing it for women now.

NoDak · Jul 3, 2015

skidadl said:
I raised my kid with the following principals:

1. Don't complain. Be a doer, not a complainer.

2. Respect authority. Always. Unless it is in conflict with your morals (Christian) then find a peaceful way to deal with things. If that doesn't work use force. Like if you have to kick another kid's ass make it the last resort.

3. See everything as an opportunity to learn and be prepared for whatever God has for you next.

4. Do not despise the day of small beginnings.

5. Don't be a pussy.

3.

I do not know your kid, but I like him.

NoDak · Jul 3, 2015

I went through basic training TWICE. And never once thought of killing myself. Nor did I feel like the experience was dehumanizing. It was supposed to be tough. And in my opinion has gotten too soft over the last 20 years. Letting any and everybody through is a good way to get them or others killed.

townsend · Jul 3, 2015

L.T. Fan said:
During wartime an individual is subject to being captured by the enemy and they will use "dehumanizing" tatics. As to the hair thats simply a matter of ensuring there are no health or bug issues with one's scalp. We had plenty of orentatation regarding what to expect but still it didn't keep a few from climbing a water tower and doing a swan dive. Some simply shouldn't enlist. They cannot deal with the mental conditioning.

I agree that if you can't take the training, you probably shouldn't be in the military. (as I said before, it wasn't a problem for me) My issue was that people acted like service members weren't dehumanized in the military. You are, intentionally, for a purpose.

townsend · Jul 3, 2015

NoDak said:
I went through basic training TWICE. And never once thought of killing myself.

I never thought of killing myself in basic either. But more importantly, who the fuck cares? Do you wanna cookie? If someone had a peanut allergy would you brag about how many peanuts you could eat?

NoDak · Jul 3, 2015

townsend said:
But head shaving, sleep deprivation, and chants are also stuff every cult does to break a person's sense of self. .

All bullshit aside, do you SERIOUSLY believe this? Like, this is the reason they do this? To break their sense of self? Or to dehumanize them?

In case you're wondering the head shaving thing in basic training is for basic hygiene. Ease of cleanliness, control of head lice, etc... Soldiers are living in very close quarters to each other during that time. Once this initial phase of training is over, they're allowed to grow their hair out longer. And I have never seen this sleep deprivation you are talking of. Are you talking about being made to stay awake for 24 or so hours? Or being made to pull fire guard during the night? That is NOT sleep deprivation. I'd be interested in hearing your examples of this sleep deprivation you are talking about.

As for the rest of the stuff, I have literally never heard of anybody having it nearly as rough as you are talking of here. In any of the 4 major branches of service. You must be the unluckiest guy to EVER enlist.

NoDak · Jul 3, 2015

townsend said:
I never thought of killing myself in basic either. But more importantly, who the fuck cares? Do you wanna cookie? If someone had a peanut allergy would you brag about how many peanuts you could eat?

You are the guy talking about wanting to kill yourself every day for two years. So apparently, you fucking cared. At least enough to cry about it here, anyway.

townsend · Jul 3, 2015

NoDak said:
All bullshit aside, do you SERIOUSLY believe this? Like, this is the reason they do this? To break their sense of self? Or to dehumanize them?

In case you're wondering the head shaving thing in basic training is for basic hygiene. Ease of cleanliness, control of head lice, etc... Soldiers are living in very close quarters to each other during that time. Once this initial phase of training is over, they're allowed to grow their hair out longer. And I have never seen this sleep deprivation you are talking of. Are you talking about being made to stay awake for 24 or so hours? Or being made to pull fire guard during the night? That is NOT sleep deprivation. I'd be interested in hearing your examples of this sleep deprivation you are talking about.

As for the rest of the stuff, I have literally never heard of anybody having it nearly as rough as you are talking of here. In any of the 4 major branches of service. You must be the unluckiest guy to EVER enlist.

Do I think an organization meant specifically to train young people to work selflessly as part of a unit would use age old indoctrination techniques? Yes. Yes I do. Please show me another circumstance where the previously mentioned techniques are used outside of cult initiation and brain washing.

Bull shit. http://time.com/3659629/navy-haircuts-women/

The initial 24 hours (It was 48 in my case, and the case of everyone I showed up with, from reporting to MEPS to racking in two days later.0 Once again, show me a situation outside of the military and a cult where you are not allowed to sleep for an extended period of time.

Once again. I'm not necessarily against basic training. But it's definitively dehumanizing. Fuck listen to any Drill instructor talk about their recruits. Do the descriptions sound like they're human?

skidadl · Jul 3, 2015

My kid is getting about 3-4 hours of sleep per day right now. It is tough. That has been going on for 6 weeks. Apparently they are shutting the dorms down after his class so there are no new soldiers to help maintain the place. They have about 35-40% of the help that they normally have. That leaves him with all of the duties plus some pretty rigorous studies that are hard for normal folks. He's dyslexic and never told anyone because he doesn't want it to interfere with his dream of being a nurse practitioner. So the kid had to study constantly. But he does it without complaining because he's not a pussy.

skidadl · Jul 3, 2015

The Navy doesn't even march in the rain.

Hahahahahaa!!!!

townsend · Jul 3, 2015

NoDak said:
As for the rest of the stuff, I have literally never heard of anybody having it nearly as rough as you are talking of here. In any of the 4 major branches of service. You must be the unluckiest guy to EVER enlist.

You've clearly not met that many navy nukes. I have to steer clear of them most the time because my life is way better when I don't have to think about the my time on the Submarine.

I was never shot, burned to death, or raped. In my division (shortly before I arrived) there was a guy who had his appendix burst, and gotten written up for faking an illness, just before having to have emergency surgery. So actually, I could count myself lucky.

Supreme Court rules in favor of same-sex marriage nationwide

Banned

I'm Easy If You Are

El Presidente'

El Presidente'

Banned

El Presidente'

I'm Easy If You Are

Senior Tech

Banned

Banned

Hotlinking' sonofabitch

Hotlinking' sonofabitch

Banned

Banned

Hotlinking' sonofabitch

Hotlinking' sonofabitch

Banned

El Presidente'

El Presidente'

Banned