Plan For The DL

mschmidt64 said:

I just admitted the other day that Spears was overdrafted; will you say the same about Claiborne?

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Spears was overdrafted in hindsight, but the decision made sense at the time. Our scouting team plain got it wrong if Parcells was considering taking him at 12, but at 21 or wherever we ended up taking him he seemed to be slotted OK based on publications and other resources we fans have. We don't have other teams' draft boards, so we'll never know if Spears was truly overdrafted based on what the team should have known.

Claiborne was considered by consensus (again according to publications) the best defensive player in the 2012 draft. Regardless of how one feels about the position he plays, he was not drafted beyond the slot where he should have gone.

The poor decision on Dallas' part was in trading 1st and 2nd round picks to get him given their obvious needs at multiple positions and having already signed Carr and Scandrick to big deals. Hard to say that Claiborne will ever be equal to both Bobby Wagner (who already has a Superbowl ring) and Michael Brockers, but by that standard everyone drafted in the top ten outside of Andrew Luck was overdrafted.

Hindsight will tells us how effective Claiborne was relative to the other defensive players in that draft. In that group Kuechly and Poe look to be studs, and of the others... Mark Barron, Quentin Coples, Dre Kirkpatrick, Fletcher Cox, Brockers, Wagner, etc, etc ... none are exactly setting the world on fire.

Claiborne has been a strong addition to the defense when he's healthy. That's the key for him, staying healthy, and not trying to be better than Wagner and Brockers combined. That's Jerry's fault, not Claiborne's.

Trading up for Claiborne is symptomatic of Jerry always thinking we are closer than we are to getting to the Super Bowl. We had and still have a very thin roster and we aren't taking steps to bolster it because Jerry thinks that UDFA mana falls from heaven to magically fill needs.

I'd take every one of those guys you just named over Claiborne straight up.

Bluestar71 said:

Free and Ware being asked to take cuts don't represent any kind of philosophical change in decision making. When this starts happening regularly you can claim things are changing, but right now you're jumping the gun.

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That is where you are wrong about what I am saying. I am saying that they are "showing signs" of changing. Not that there has been a definite change. Just like the quote from several years ago of "Jerry will never spend a first round pick on the offensive line," that has changed, hasn't it?

I think it's hard to give credit for philosophy changes when the moves to draft OL and limit cap expenditures only occurred under the most dire of circumstances for each.

Clay_Allison said:

I think it's hard to give credit for philosophy changes when the moves to draft OL and limit cap expenditures only occurred under the most dire of circumstances for each.

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Sure, but it's not utterly dire right now, though still not good.

So if they paid attention to OL again, that'd be nice.

ravidubey said:

Three 1st rounders, two 3rd rounders, and a 6th is the sum total of their "damned good" drafting from the last *four* years. Six legit starters in four years just isn't getting it done.

It's about as good as the so called "best drafting teams" do. You have to hit on your first rounder as a starter. Hope to hit on a later round (2-4) as a major contributor. And one other pick as a contributor/possible future stater. If you look at the last teams to win a SB and how they drafted in the three years prior to the SB win, those numbers bear out. A notable exception would be the 2006 draft where the Saints hit on 75% of their draft picks. Most teams just don't do that. There were three pretty good articles on the subject below:

Doing it the Right Way: Part I Introduction http://www.cowboysnation.com/2014/02/doing-it-right-way.html
Doing it the Right Way: Part I The Data http://www.cowboysnation.com/2014/02/doing-it-right-way-pt-ii-data.html
Doing it the Right Way: Part II What is Right http://www.cowboysnation.com/2014/02/doing-it-right-way-pt-iii-what-is-right.html


Sean Lee, Bruce Carter, and Tyrone Crawford have each barely played because of injuries, and I don't see how you can even count James Hanna. The rest are either cross-fingers-and-pray types or just chaff.

Have we seen anything from Kyle Wilber that would lead you to believe he could ever start for real?

Actually yes, but at SAM LB. He was holding down that position pretty well the last 4 games of the season.

I'm more excited about DaVonte Holloman, flaws and all, but he's still an unknown quantity as a potential starter.



The worst thing they ever did was sign Lee to that stupid deal. No mater how "favorable" they needed it to be incentive-laced to the max. Instead they went all Jerry and put it on faith that Lee would stay healthy. Now it's to the point the man can't even make a tackle without hurting his neck and threatening his career. Only Jerry.

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See above

hstour said:

See above

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I think you could have made that post more confusing to read. Try harder next time.

Iamtdg said:

I think you could have made that post more confusing to read. Try harder next time.

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My comments to specific statements made are in blue beneath them. My apologies for not considering that the (color) blind would not be able to follow along....

Gauging Jason Hatcher's market
March, 11, 2014

By Todd Archer | ESPNDallas.com

IRVING, Texas -- Jason Hatcher has been waiting for this day for a long time.

He will soon find out how much the rest of the NFL thinks of him and whether he will be a former Dallas Cowboys defensive tackle.

It is not an apples-to-apples comparison, but in the last week two defensive ends have signed contracts that could be an indication of what Hatcher, who led the Cowboys in sacks (11) in 2013, gets paid.

The Minnesota Vikings signed Everson Griffen to a five-year, $42.5 million deal with $20 million guaranteed. He had 17.5 sacks in his first four seasons and has started only one game. The Vikings, however, are changing the face of their defensive line and will likely say goodbye to Jared Allen and Kevin Williams in favor of Griffen and Sharrif Floyd.

Griffen is also 26.

On Monday, the Seattle Seahawks re-signed Michael Bennett to a four-year, $28.5 million deal with $16 million guaranteed. Bennett had 8.5 sacks in 2013 in helping the Seahawks win the Super Bowl. He has 23.5 sacks in his career, including 17.5 in the last two seasons.

He is 28.

Hatcher’s first bite at the free-agent market came in 2011 after a lockout. Teams acted quickly and Hatcher took a three-year, $6 million deal from the Cowboys. Up to that point he had started one game and never had more than 2.5 sacks in a season.

Now 31 and coming off his best season, Hatcher wants to cash in. If Griffen can get a deal worth $8.5 million annually and Bennett, who is better than Griffen, gets $7.125 million annually, then does that keep Hatcher in the $6 million-a-year neighborhood? Maybe it's in the mid-$5 million range.

He plays a different position, but ends tend to have more value than tackles, even in a 4-3. Age will also be a factor. It can be argued Hatcher does not have as many miles on his soon-to-be 32-year-old body, but that won’t inflate his price that much.

The Cowboys would have to create cap room for a deal. They could re-work the deal for DeMarcus Ware or release the seven-time Pro Bowler, or they cut lower-priced players to fit Hatcher’s first-year cap figure. They don’t want to restructure anymore contracts.

Teams like the Indianapolis Colts and Tampa Bay Buccaneers are believed to have interest in Hatcher, but what type of interest is it?

It seemed like a foregone conclusion when the season ended that Hatcher would not be with the Cowboys in 2014, but the salary cap has increased and his price might be more palatable than originally believed.

I'm just curious who his options are. There are the bottom feeder teams with tons of cap space so if this is just a money hunt, he has those options. I'm sure Oakland or Jacksonville would take him. But who else?

The Bucs have 2 solid, young DT's and just gave a ton of money to Johnson. I'll count them out.

Deuce said:

I'm just curious who his options are. There are the bottom feeder teams with tons of cap space so if this is just a money hunt, he has those options. I'm sure Oakland or Jacksonville would take him. But who else?

The Bucs have 2 solid, young DT's and just gave a ton of money to Johnson. I'll count them out.

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I could see the Falcons being interested.

boozeman said:

I could see the Falcons being interested.

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They just signed Soliai and Tyson Jackson. Sounds like they are moving to 3-4. I doubt Hatcher ends up there now, though they can have Ware.