2016 POTUS Election Thread

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townsend

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How would you classify Hillary's knowledge of business and economics?Notwithstanding her philosophy of each but her actual hands on experience. To my knowledge she has little if any actual experience with budgets, the Fed. or the banking system. To my knowledge she has never owned or operated a business. As a Senator she served on a few committees and as Secretary of State she was a cabinet member in an advisory captivity to the president but business and economic matters are lacking.
Well she was an investor in Whitewater :unsure

Seriously though, she has ran an exceptionally successful Clinton Foundation, and also technically owns several shell companies. Which isn't great, but as far as I can tell she's never had to declare bankruptcy on any of them. She also served on the board for Wal-Mart and TCBY. She was also on the board of directors for Legal Services Corporation, she was also a full partner at Rose law firm. So I think it's safe to say she has some understanding of business. She also made 100 grand trading futures on cattle contracts
 

L.T. Fan

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She was on 5 committees as a Senator and one of them was the budget committee.
Of which a budget was never submitted during the democratic administration while she served on those committees.
 

Clay_Allison

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Of which a budget was never submitted during the democratic administration while she served on those committees.
She wasn't a Senator during a Democratic Administration. Her entire time in the Senate was during the Bush administration.
 

townsend

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Of which a budget was never submitted during the democratic administration while she served on those committees.
You're being persnickety. The question was what business experience she had. Obviously there can, shall, and always will be question of whether or not she's corrupt. My point is that she's not a business laymen in the same way that Trump would be a llaymen to politics, the military, and the executive branch in general.
 

L.T. Fan

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Well she was an investor in Whitewater :unsure

Seriously though, she has ran an exceptionally successful Clinton Foundation, and also technically owns several shell companies. Which isn't great, but as far as I can tell she's never had to declare bankruptcy on any of them. She also served on the board for Wal-Mart and TCBY. She was also on the board of directors for Legal Services Corporation, she was also a full partner at Rose law firm. So I think it's safe to say she has some understanding of business. She also made 100 grand trading futures on cattle contracts
I'm not sure she run the foundation. When would she have had Time to do that?
 

Clay_Allison

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I'm not sure she run the foundation. When would she have had Time to do that?
Obama's second term, when Kerry was secretary of state. You think Bill's running anything? He's just cruising for tail at this point in his life.
 

L.T. Fan

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Obama's second term, when Kerry was secretary of state. You think Bill's running anything? He's just cruising for tail at this point in his life.
She was probably involved in fund raising but her schedule was probably pretty heavy with personal appearances. After all she has been campaigning for at least 4 years.
 

Clay_Allison

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She was probably involved in fund raising but her schedule was probably pretty heavy with personal appearances. After all she has been campaigning for at least 4 years.
I don'r presume to know the corporate structure, but I'm sure she has some role signing off on anything big.
 

Jiggyfly

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Donald Trump and the Art of the Tax Loophole
Steven Rattner MAY 13, 2016




Credit Eric Thayer for The New York Times
TYPE “Trump system rigged” into the Google search bar and you’ll get more than 500,000 hits. I didn’t inspect all of them but the first 50 were variants of Donald Trump complaining that the Republican primary process was tilted against him.

That’s beyond ironic. Mr. Trump and his family have been the beneficiaries of a great rigged system: the tax code, which bestows huge advantages on the real estate business. Throughout his career, Mr. Trump has not only grabbed for every loophole and legal lever he could find, he’s boasted about it.

“I’ve taken advantage of the laws of this country, like other people,” Mr. Trump has said.

The Republican front-runner has been dodging releasing his returns on the specious grounds that he was being audited. On Tuesday, he told The Associated Press that he wouldn’t release them before the election — period. On Wednesday, he denied saying this, reversed course and said,“Hopefully before the election I’ll release.”

“There’s nothing to learn from them,” he said in the Associated Press interview.

I’ll bet there’s plenty to learn. More likely, Mr. Trump doesn’t want us to know how small his tax hit is, something that he bragged about earlier in the campaign, before realizing that it could come back to bite him.

“I fight like hell to pay as little as possible,” Mr. Trump said last August.

Real estate guys can take advantage of the best loopholes left in the tax code, thanks in part to some aggressive nudging of lawmakers. For starters, real estate investors can take deductions for the ostensible depreciation of the value of their buildings, even though the point of owning buildings is that they generally appreciate.

For another, they often borrow against those properties, and because they hold these investments in partnerships or limited liability companies, the interest payments are tax-deductible.

“If you get close to paying taxes, you just buy another building,” a real estate friend told me.


If Mr. Trump were to sell a property, the profits would be taxed as capital gains at far lower rates (23.8 percent) than those imposed on ordinary income (39.6 percent). But real estate owners often don’t even pay capital gains taxes. They can take advantage of a provision known as Section 1031 to swap a piece of real estate that they are ready to part with for one that they would like to add to their portfolio — all tax free. There is no limit on how many swaps they can make, deferring capital gains taxes indefinitely.

Section 1031 is among the real estate operators’ favorite provisions — and it’s a break not readily available to other kinds of investors. No wonder that attempts to rein in or eliminate Section 1031, including a recent one by the Obama administration, have been met with fierce resistance from the industry.


The tax benefits don’t stop, even at death. If an investor dies holding appreciated properties, the heirs get a step up in basis, which means that they can sell the real estate and pay no taxes on the gain in value.

Mr. Trump’s quest for loopholes ranges far. In 2005, he got a $39.1 million tax deduction for donating a conservation easement on a New Jersey golf course, meaning that any further development on the property is restricted. On top of that, he installed goats on two of his New Jersey golf courses as part of a plan to get them designated as agricultural properties, thereby vastly lowering his property taxes.

Meanwhile, according to Mr. Trump’s campaign, from 2010 to 2014, he “donated” more than $102 million to charity — without giving away even $1 of his own money. More conservation easements constituted the biggest source of deductions, but the “gifts” included items like free rounds of golf for charity events. Many of these “charitable contributions,” of course, gave rise to more tax deductions.

Taxes are far from the only way that Mr. Trump has gamed the system. He’s added materially to his net worth by pushing the edges of the bankruptcy laws.

By arguing that his name had huge commercial value, for example, he managed to retain more ownership in his Atlantic City hotel and casino projects than is customary in an insolvency, thereby minimizing his losses while his creditors lost billions.




Finally, by his own admission, Mr. Trump has used our broken campaign finance system to achieve private gain by giving generously to politicians of both parties (including to Hillary Clinton) in order to gain influence. Since 1989, he has donated more than $1.5 million to political causes, 62 percent of it going to Republicans, according to PolitiFact.

“When they call, I give,” Mr. Trump said in the first Republican debate. “And you know what? When I need something from them, two years later, three years later, I call them. They are there for me.”

Among the ways that politicians have been there for him and his brethren has been developing a tax system in which real estate moguls pay little or no taxes. “The Declaration of Independence tells us that all men are created equal, but the government definitely favors real estate investors!” wrote one such investor, David Lindahl. Where did this appear? “Trump University Commercial Real Estate Investing 101.”
 

L.T. Fan

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Donald Trump and the Art of the Tax Loophole
Steven Rattner MAY 13, 2016




Credit Eric Thayer for The New York Times
TYPE “Trump system rigged” into the Google search bar and you’ll get more than 500,000 hits. I didn’t inspect all of them but the first 50 were variants of Donald Trump complaining that the Republican primary process was tilted against him.

That’s beyond ironic. Mr. Trump and his family have been the beneficiaries of a great rigged system: the tax code, which bestows huge advantages on the real estate business. Throughout his career, Mr. Trump has not only grabbed for every loophole and legal lever he could find, he’s boasted about it.

“I’ve taken advantage of the laws of this country, like other people,” Mr. Trump has said.

The Republican front-runner has been dodging releasing his returns on the specious grounds that he was being audited. On Tuesday, he told The Associated Press that he wouldn’t release them before the election — period. On Wednesday, he denied saying this, reversed course and said,“Hopefully before the election I’ll release.”

“There’s nothing to learn from them,” he said in the Associated Press interview.

I’ll bet there’s plenty to learn. More likely, Mr. Trump doesn’t want us to know how small his tax hit is, something that he bragged about earlier in the campaign, before realizing that it could come back to bite him.

“I fight like hell to pay as little as possible,” Mr. Trump said last August.

Real estate guys can take advantage of the best loopholes left in the tax code, thanks in part to some aggressive nudging of lawmakers. For starters, real estate investors can take deductions for the ostensible depreciation of the value of their buildings, even though the point of owning buildings is that they generally appreciate.

For another, they often borrow against those properties, and because they hold these investments in partnerships or limited liability companies, the interest payments are tax-deductible.

“If you get close to paying taxes, you just buy another building,” a real estate friend told me.


If Mr. Trump were to sell a property, the profits would be taxed as capital gains at far lower rates (23.8 percent) than those imposed on ordinary income (39.6 percent). But real estate owners often don’t even pay capital gains taxes. They can take advantage of a provision known as Section 1031 to swap a piece of real estate that they are ready to part with for one that they would like to add to their portfolio — all tax free. There is no limit on how many swaps they can make, deferring capital gains taxes indefinitely.

Section 1031 is among the real estate operators’ favorite provisions — and it’s a break not readily available to other kinds of investors. No wonder that attempts to rein in or eliminate Section 1031, including a recent one by the Obama administration, have been met with fierce resistance from the industry.


The tax benefits don’t stop, even at death. If an investor dies holding appreciated properties, the heirs get a step up in basis, which means that they can sell the real estate and pay no taxes on the gain in value.

Mr. Trump’s quest for loopholes ranges far. In 2005, he got a $39.1 million tax deduction for donating a conservation easement on a New Jersey golf course, meaning that any further development on the property is restricted. On top of that, he installed goats on two of his New Jersey golf courses as part of a plan to get them designated as agricultural properties, thereby vastly lowering his property taxes.

Meanwhile, according to Mr. Trump’s campaign, from 2010 to 2014, he “donated” more than $102 million to charity — without giving away even $1 of his own money. More conservation easements constituted the biggest source of deductions, but the “gifts” included items like free rounds of golf for charity events. Many of these “charitable contributions,” of course, gave rise to more tax deductions.

Taxes are far from the only way that Mr. Trump has gamed the system. He’s added materially to his net worth by pushing the edges of the bankruptcy laws.

By arguing that his name had huge commercial value, for example, he managed to retain more ownership in his Atlantic City hotel and casino projects than is customary in an insolvency, thereby minimizing his losses while his creditors lost billions.




Finally, by his own admission, Mr. Trump has used our broken campaign finance system to achieve private gain by giving generously to politicians of both parties (including to Hillary Clinton) in order to gain influence. Since 1989, he has donated more than $1.5 million to political causes, 62 percent of it going to Republicans, according to PolitiFact.

“When they call, I give,” Mr. Trump said in the first Republican debate. “And you know what? When I need something from them, two years later, three years later, I call them. They are there for me.”

Among the ways that politicians have been there for him and his brethren has been developing a tax system in which real estate moguls pay little or no taxes. “The Declaration of Independence tells us that all men are created equal, but the government definitely favors real estate investors!” wrote one such investor, David Lindahl. Where did this appear? “Trump University Commercial Real Estate Investing 101.”
Tell me when.You get to the part where any laws are broken.
 

Jiggyfly

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Donald Trump on Muslim ban: 'Everything is a suggestion'

By Tom LoBianco, CNN
Updated 12:17 PM ET, Fri May 13, 2016


Donald Trump has long called for a ban on Muslims entering the U.S. but his position appears to have soften this week

The real estate mogul said he's "flexible on the issues"

Washington (CNN)Presumptive Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump continued Friday to define his proposal to ban Muslims from entering the country, saying he wants to study the issue of radical Islam and that he was "flexible" in his response.

"We have to do something and you're not going to do something about until you know what the problem is. I've spoken to (former New York City mayor) Rudy Giuliani we're going to put together a group. We're going to look at the problem, we're going to study the problem, it's a temporary ban," Trump said Friday on Fox News' "Fox and Friends." "I feel very strongly that we have to find out what the problem is. When you look at San Bernardino, when you look at Paris, when you look at all of these horrible, horrible acts of hatred, this is pure hatred. We have to find out and get to the bottom of the problem before we can solve it."

Trump called in December "for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on" he said in a statement. But he revised his language Wednesday to Fox News Radio's Brian Kilmeade, saying that his proposed ban was "just a suggestion" and "hasn't been called for yet."

But he argued Friday that he wasn't changing his tone at all.

"Look, anything I say right now -- I'm not the president, everything is a suggestion. No matter what you say, it is a suggestion," Trump said Friday on NBC's "Today," adding later, "No, I'm not softening my stance at all but I'm always flexible on issues."

Trump's apparently softened position comes after months of being hammered on the issue consistently by his Republican and Democratic opponents. What changed is that he is now the presumptive nominee of the Republican Party.s are dangerous. Your words are reckless. Your record is embarrassing. And your free ride is over.

Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren, who has been mentioned a possible running mate for Hillary Clinton, went after Trump for his proposed Muslim ban and other policies in a tweetstorm this week.

Trump has long said that his proposed ban on Muslim entry to the United States would be temporary, but has never said how long that would last. He told Fox News Friday that Giuliani's review of Muslim entry into the U.S. would be part of a broader review of immigration by a prospective Trump administration.

He did not say Friday who else would serve on the broader immigration review group.

Trump's Muslim ban came after tens of thousands of Syrians fled their homeland, leading to a immigration crisis in Europe. President Barack Obama pledged to take in 10,000 Syrian refugees, but as of last month the U.S. had only admitted about 1,300 refugees.

CNN's Tal Kopan contributed to this report.
 

Jiggyfly

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Donald Trump on recording: Not me

By Tal Kopan and Jeremy Diamond, CNN
Updated 6:31 PM ET, Fri May 13, 2016




Washington (CNN)Donald Trump said Friday that a newly resurfaced recording of a man who sounds like Trump posing as his spokesman isn't him — even though he has admitted in the past to posing as his own publicist under a pseudonym.

"It was not me on the phone," Trump told NBC's "Today" show when the recording was played for him during a live interview. "And it doesn't sound like me on the phone, I'll tell you that, and it was not me on the phone."
NBC was asking Trump about a Washington Post report published earlier Friday that claims Trump routinely made calls to reporters in the 1970s, '80s and '90s posing as a publicist named John Miller or John Barron, advocating for himself and answering questions about his personal life and business dealings.

The man in the 14-minute recording sounds much like Trump, and the Post pointed to Trump's long appreciation of the name Barron, including the name of his youngest son.

The Post also cited 1990 court case testimony in which Trump testified, "I believe on occasion I used that name" when asked about Barron. CNN has obtained a copy of Trump's testimony during that case.

On "Today" Friday morning, Trump at first said he didn't "think" it was him on the recording.

"This sounds like one of the scams, one of the many scams, doesn't sound like me," Trump said. "I don't think it was me, it doesn't sound like me."

When pressed by the anchors, Trump explicitly said it wasn't him.

And then he testily told the journalists to move on.

"You're going so low to talk about something that took place 25 years ago whether or not I made a phone call?" Trump said. "Let's get on to more current subjects."

Thomas Owens, a New Jersey-based forensic audio specialist, told CNN Friday that based on several criteria -- including pitch, tone and cadence -- Miller's voice in the audio obtained by the Post is consistent with Trump's in the early 1990s.

"I can conclude with a fair degree of scientific certainty that it is Donald Trump's voice," Owens said, though he noted that due to the recording's quality, he wasn't able to use biometric analysis that would make him absolutely certain.

Friday afternoon, Washington Post reporter James Hohmann tweeted that Trump's telephone line "went silent, then dead, this afternoon when WaPo asked: 'Did you ever employ someone named John Miller as a spokesperson?'"


Sue Carswell, a former People magazine reporter whose 1991 interview with Miller was highlighted in the Post article, told NBC News' Cynthia McFadden Friday that the publicist was "absolutely" Trump.
"No doubt in your mind?" McFadden asked.

"There's no doubt in my mind," Carswell replied.

An open secret

Trump's history of impersonating his own spokesman has long been an open secret at the Trump Organization and among New York media circles.

At least one former Trump Organization executive has confirmed to CNN that Trump at times responded to media requests personally under the guise of a spokesman.

Trump's apparent alter ego was quoted repeatedly and prominently in newspapers, magazines and especially in the gossip pages of New York tabloids.

In 1984 and 1985, several New York Times articles attributed quotes about Trump's business dealings to "John Barron, a vice president of the Trump Organization."

And Trump's unofficial biographers also pulled the thin veil off Trump's cover identity.

Michael D'Antonio wrote in "Never Enough: Donald Trump and the Pursuit of Success" that "John Barron was a way for Trump to talk himself up."

"He'd be able to express things that he wanted expressed about himself by someone that wasn't him," D'Antonio wrote.

And the audio recording reveals more than just a remarkable likeness to Trump's own voice, but also in the spokesman's cadence, word choice and the billionaire's trademark bravado.

Discussing Trump's divorce and his prospects with women, "John Miller" said Trump is "somebody that has a lot of options, and, frankly, he gets called by everybody. He gets called by everybody in the book, in terms of women," according to the audio recording obtained by The Washington Post.

Miller also describes a past encounter between Trump and Madonna in great detail.

"Madonna was in the room, and so somebody from Madonna's entourage -- because she comes in with an entourage of dancers and everything else -- and somebody from Madonna's entourage came over and said, 'Would you go over and say hello to Madonna?' And so he went over and said hello to Madonna and he gave his autograph to the dancers. She said, 'These are fans' and all this. 'Will you give them the autograph?' So he said, 'Best wishes' or something," Miller said, according to the recording. "And then all of a sudden -- and that was the end. And then he said goodbye to her and that was literally the end. He's got zero interest in Madonna. It was literally the end."

The spokesman then goes on to purport that Madonna "wanted to go out" with Trump.

Amid regaling the reporter with tales of Trump's encounters with models, actresses and the pop queen, the spokesman added in an aside: "By the way, I'm sort of new here."
 

L.T. Fan

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Donald Trump on Muslim ban: 'Everything is a suggestion'

By Tom LoBianco, CNN
Updated 12:17 PM ET, Fri May 13, 2016


Donald Trump has long called for a ban on Muslims entering the U.S. but his position appears to have soften this week

The real estate mogul said he's "flexible on the issues"

Washington (CNN)Presumptive Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump continued Friday to define his proposal to ban Muslims from entering the country, saying he wants to study the issue of radical Islam and that he was "flexible" in his response.

"We have to do something and you're not going to do something about until you know what the problem is. I've spoken to (former New York City mayor) Rudy Giuliani we're going to put together a group. We're going to look at the problem, we're going to study the problem, it's a temporary ban," Trump said Friday on Fox News' "Fox and Friends." "I feel very strongly that we have to find out what the problem is. When you look at San Bernardino, when you look at Paris, when you look at all of these horrible, horrible acts of hatred, this is pure hatred. We have to find out and get to the bottom of the problem before we can solve it."

Trump called in December "for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on" he said in a statement. But he revised his language Wednesday to Fox News Radio's Brian Kilmeade, saying that his proposed ban was "just a suggestion" and "hasn't been called for yet."

But he argued Friday that he wasn't changing his tone at all.

"Look, anything I say right now -- I'm not the president, everything is a suggestion. No matter what you say, it is a suggestion," Trump said Friday on NBC's "Today," adding later, "No, I'm not softening my stance at all but I'm always flexible on issues."

Trump's apparently softened position comes after months of being hammered on the issue consistently by his Republican and Democratic opponents. What changed is that he is now the presumptive nominee of the Republican Party.s are dangerous. Your words are reckless. Your record is embarrassing. And your free ride is over.

Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren, who has been mentioned a possible running mate for Hillary Clinton, went after Trump for his proposed Muslim ban and other policies in a tweetstorm this week.

Trump has long said that his proposed ban on Muslim entry to the United States would be temporary, but has never said how long that would last. He told Fox News Friday that Giuliani's review of Muslim entry into the U.S. would be part of a broader review of immigration by a prospective Trump administration.

He did not say Friday who else would serve on the broader immigration review group.

Trump's Muslim ban came after tens of thousands of Syrians fled their homeland, leading to a immigration crisis in Europe. President Barack Obama pledged to take in 10,000 Syrian refugees, but as of last month the U.S. had only admitted about 1,300 refugees.

CNN's Tal Kopan contributed to this report.
Sounds like Obama has a ban as well.
 

townsend

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Sounds like Obama has a ban as well.
Our vetting process is extremely long. Getting admitted as a refugee takes somewhere around 2 or 3 years I've heard. We probably won't have a full 10000 here till Obama is well out of office.
 

L.T. Fan

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Our vetting process is extremely long. Getting admitted as a refugee takes somewhere around 2 or 3 years I've heard. We probably won't have a full 10000 here till Obama is well out of office.
That's a smart move and the gist of what Trump was getting at. He wanted a process to screen them but until it was in place he proposed a ban.
 

Smitty

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If you think I'm biased for Hillary, you're deeply incorrect. There were a few candidates on both sides of the aisle that I'd prefer to Hillary, not that they're any more smart, but her deep penchant for interventionism scares me. In this very thread I've criticized Hillary for her hawkishness, and corruptiblity but you guys are so busy trying to paint me as some kind of huge fan of hers, I guess you haven't noticed.

I didn't want Jalen Smith or Zeke. But I know for a fact that Zeke was a better pick. I'm not biased towards him, the other person was just so bad, it wasn't even a contest as to which was superior. Same thing with Hillary. But because I'm the guy who thinks "retarded" is an offensive term I have to face extensive scrutiny over an evaluation I've put plenty of time, research, and effort into.

It's not splitting hairs. Not even close. Trump has showed up to this contest without even a basic level of understanding of the issues, a consistent platform, a temperament worthy of the presidency, or even the strong support of anyone who knows what the job entails. He's a dumbass who's been elected by the least common denominator of a broken party And you don't even disagree with me on that!
Maybe biased for Hillary or against Trump, I don't know (and this is coming from someone who will assuredly not be voting for Trump in the fall). I just think to paint her as acceptably competent and him unacceptably incompetent is a left-driven media perspective without much truth to it.
 

L.T. Fan

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Maybe biased for Hillary or against Trump, I don't know (and this is coming from someone who will assuredly not be voting for Trump in the fall). I just think to paint her as acceptably competent and him unacceptably incompetent is a left-driven media perspective without much truth to it.
That's exactly the way I see it. It's a paint the distortation canvas anyway you can no matter what the truth may be. Tells me the folks are pretty worried that all the money they pumped into Hillary might be in jeopardy and its a desperate attempt to ensure it doesn't happen. Trump spent a minimal amount to become the candidate but the political machine has been investing in Hillary for months and by the millions. To see it in becoming a lost effort is panic time.
 

townsend

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Maybe biased for Hillary or against Trump, I don't know (and this is coming from someone who will assuredly not be voting for Trump in the fall). I just think to paint her as acceptably competent and him unacceptably incompetent is a left-driven media perspective without much truth to it.
Would you describe Trump as exceptionally competent? He's made more bone headed business decisions than Hillary has. So I don't see that how he could hope to be comparable to her competence level in a field she has a 20+year head start on, and as I've stated, if he was of the mind to catch up, he wouldn't be learning what the nuclear triad is from Marco Rubio during a debate.


Because frankly he's less successful than Jerry Jones, and I think we'd all be shitting our pants if ol Jer (a business mogul with nearly a flawless record) had won the Republican primary.

Hillary is a wildly successful attorney/politician/executive whose 40 year resume speaks very highly of her competence level. I think you'd be very hard pressed to find someone who she's worked with who would call her incompetent.
 
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