This Little Pipeline Protest

Jiggyfly

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Yeah I could never imagine using mass transit on a daily basis. I've lived in St. Louis and used the MetroLink, it wasn't good for so many reasons. In college we had the campus buses which were a nightmare and slow as hell.

I see areas where mass transit works but I don't think it will ever be able to largely replace the individual transit people currently employ. Not without some sort of communist like mandates.

With all that being said I'd love to do a train ride for a long trip. I've heard wonderful things and it really does allow an ability for you to sort of actually enjoy the commute as opposed to being stuck in some cramped space like most trips (Car, plane or bus).
You are protoypical of the biggest issues to implementing what Iamtdg is talking about.

Most Americans outside of the northeastern corridor feel this way, you can build all of this stuff and have it be cheaper, faster and safer but unless people want to get out of their cars and give up a little convenience then it will never work.
 

Cotton

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You are protoypical of the biggest issues to implementing what Iamtdg is talking about.

Most Americans outside of the northeastern corridor feel this way, you can build all of this stuff and have it be cheaper, faster and safer but unless people want to get out of their cars and give up a little convenience then it will never work.
It's tough, man. That mindset is exactly the hurdle I try to leap on a daily basis.
 

L.T. Fan

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You are protoypical of the biggest issues to implementing what Iamtdg is talking about.

Most Americans outside of the northeastern corridor feel this way, you can build all of this stuff and have it be cheaper, faster and safer but unless people want to get out of their cars and give up a little convenience then it will never work.
True. It not a matter of what is best because mass transit is the most sensible thing to reduce petroleum use for the working public but the astronomical cost to build a non profit system will not get off the ground in most areas of the US.
 

Cotton

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True. It not a matter of what is best because mass transit is the most sensible thing to reduce petroleum use for the working public but the astronomical cost to build a non profit system will not get off the ground in most areas of the US.
And, like I said before, this is where the government has to step in and help. I'm not a huge fan of big government, but it can serve a purpose.
 

L.T. Fan

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It's tough, man. That mindset is exactly the hurdle I try to leap on a daily basis.
As a matter of academic sensibility, mass transit is a better option. When you move from academics to practicality, for most of the country it isn't econimally feasible. It's good solution but the costs are prohibitive because of an almost certain zero return. Actually it would create a continuing subsidy for almost any community it serves.
 

L.T. Fan

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And, like I said before, this is where the government has to step in and help. I'm not a huge fan of big government, but it can serve a purpose.
The governments pocket is the taxpayers purse.
 

Jiggyfly

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Nuclear would be great, but every time a new plant is proposed the left and environmentalists go nuts. Battery powered cars don't have the capacity to go long distances and still aren't as efficient as gas powered cars. Plus, while touting them as a solution, they are actually worse for the environment because battery technology creates problems with their construction and disposal. Again the left will cry foul. Solar...has some uses, but not a large enough scale to be practical. Wind, could be but the enviro nuts are worried it kills birds, so there you go.
It would help in these discussions if you stop with "all of the Left".

Its that type of talk that causes the divisiveness you have such an issue with, you seem very quick to lump people together to make a point, that is not conducive to having a productive discussion.
 

dallen

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You are protoypical of the biggest issues to implementing what Iamtdg is talking about.

Most Americans outside of the northeastern corridor feel this way, you can build all of this stuff and have it be cheaper, faster and safer but unless people want to get out of their cars and give up a little convenience then it will never work.
They are building a bullet train from Houston to Dallas. I hate that trip. I'll sign up for the train the minute it is running. But as far as my daily commute goes....forget that. Houston Metro blows
 

townsend

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It would help in these discussions if you stop with "all of the Left".

Its that type of talk that causes the divisiveness you have such an issue with, you seem very quick to lump people together to make a point, that is not conducive to having a productive discussion.
The funny thing about American politics is that the fringe left and the fringe right have more in common with each other than the moderates from their own side. Which is why dumb hippies and dumb evangelicals are both not vaccinating their kids. (Although mainstream republicans are still willing to treat the scientific consensus as a liberal conspiracy).
 

Cotton

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It would help in these discussions if you stop with "all of the Left".

Its that type of talk that causes the divisiveness you have such an issue with, you seem very quick to lump people together to make a point, that is not conducive to having a productive discussion.
Yeah, it's not a left or right thing. It's a practical operational thing.
 

Jiggyfly

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They are building a bullet train from Houston to Dallas. I hate that trip. I'll sign up for the train the minute it is running. But as far as my daily commute goes....forget that. Houston Metro blows
Is that thing actually ever being built?

And yes Houston Metro blows, Houston is great example of a city needing mass transit and having no real will to implement it.
 

Jiggyfly

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The funny thing about American politics is that the fringe left and the fringe right have more in common with each other than the moderates from their own side. Which is why dumb hippies and dumb evangelicals are both not vaccinating their kids. (Although mainstream republicans are still willing to treat the scientific consensus as a liberal conspiracy).
I am just tired of the whole Left and Right thing, it's time to get off the winner take all mentality and start realizing both Conservatives and Liberals have something to bring to the table.

That is the one silver lining I see with a Trump presidency he is not an ideologue and seems open to listen to anybody.
 

townsend

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Is that thing actually ever being built?

And yes Houston Metro blows, Houston is great example of a city needing mass transit and having no real will to implement it.
I always get the sense, when I'm in Houston, that no one planned any of it.
 

townsend

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I am just tired of the whole Left and Right thing, it's time to get off the winner take all mentality and start realizing both Conservatives and Liberals have something to bring to the table.

That is the one silver lining I see with a Trump presidency he is not an ideologue and seems open to listen to anybody.
More importantly he's forging unusual alliances against him. A dove and a hawk can take issue with his Putin friendly cabinet. Guys like Joe Walsh, Dinesh D'Souza, and Sarah Palin have been vocal critics of Trump.

I think new, weird battle lines are getting drawn, and we're gonna be really surprised at the people we agree with.
 

dallen

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Is that thing actually ever being built?

And yes Houston Metro blows, Houston is great example of a city needing mass transit and having no real will to implement it.
The last I heard they were going to begin construction next year and plan on having it finished by 2022. So if it is done by 2025 it will be a miracle.
 

Cotton

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I always get the sense, when I'm in Houston, that no one planned any of it.
Houston is the perfect example of the halfass implementation some cities threw at the issue hoping it would be enough. No real planning not guidance from a professional.
 

Cotton

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Behavioral patterns aside, the difficulty of planning & executing good mass transit is f'n difficult. So much easier to pave an 8-lane asphalt road and call it a day.

People spend good money traveling to Paris, London and all these beautiful cities. There's no geographic reason why we couldn't build them here. But it's easier to keep a litter of kittens in a box than coordinate zoning, private builders, NIMBYs & mass transit agencies.

Getting people to move into new densely apartments/condos/townhomes is actually the easiest part. Snatch that up like pussy fiends.
It's not as difficult as you think once you have buy-in from both users and planners.
 

townsend

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I can't imagine how shitty it must be to be someone one who can't drive in the south.

I have a cousin who had a seizure and can't get a license. She pretty much lost her adulthood.
 
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