2016 POTUS Election Thread

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Jiggyfly

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So typical trot out the black person as the defining voice on the subject.

Keep getting dem checks Stacy, never mind the fact that Hillary won the popular vote.:lol
 

Cotton

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I really would like to know why you think urban areas are war zones.

Where does that come from?
What the hell that has to do with what I or skid posted is beyond me. But, the assassinations of cops would be the biggest reason. But, how about we not derail this thread with something that has already been discussed and has jack nor shit to do with what skid posted, and I agreed with.
 

NoDak

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So typical trot out the black person as the defining voice on the subject.

Keep getting dem checks Stacy, never mind the fact that Hillary won the popular vote.:lol
Nobody said that this was the defining voice on anything. Just a different point of view from somebody that clearly doesn't fit into the Trump hates blacks narrative being pushed. And what does this woman's opinion here have to do with Clinton winning the popular vote?

Why do you insist on making shit up just to drive your need to argue? And I am clearly not the only person that sees this. Hell, you've been called out or outright laughed at and ridiculed by 4-5 different people in the last page or two of this thread.
 

data

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That sounds good and all but could you kindly tell me when in history has white America ever willingly treated everyone equally without the aid of protest and civil disobedience?
Wasn't my point. Why did Trump win? He captured the votes of a woken beast, the rural white vote. I'm neither rural, nor white, so I'm guessing why they woke.

As little as I know about being rural or white, rural white voters know little about urban race relations. Their knowledge is likely from TV and TV was all Kaep, riots, police killings.

Is Kaep, BLM the wrong/right way? I don't know, but whether right/wrong, necessary/unnecessary, it's what I think stirred up the rural white vote.

To your point about protest/civil disobedience...Maybe not equally, but white America has better accepted the model minority Asians, possibly because it's been without protest nor civil disobedience. Asians are better educated, less violent, higher income, but, on the flipside, haven't held strongly to our cultural identity (as opposed to Latinos/blacks) and becoming white-washed. To clarify, Asian-American immigration history is way different than Latinos/blacks and I'm not necessarily advocating that they should/can go the Asian route.
 

Cowboysrock55

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So typical trot out the black person as the defining voice on the subject.

Keep getting dem checks Stacy, never mind the fact that Hillary won the popular vote.:lol
Yeah ignore that everything she said was spot on.
 

L.T. Fan

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Wasn't my point. Why did Trump win? He captured the votes of a woken beast, the rural white vote. I'm neither rural, nor white, so I'm guessing why they woke.

As little as I know about being rural or white, rural white voters know little about urban race relations. Their knowledge is likely from TV and TV was all Kaep, riots, police killings.

Is Kaep, BLM the wrong/right way? I don't know, but whether right/wrong, necessary/unnecessary, it's what I think stirred up the rural white vote.

To your point about protest/civil disobedience...Maybe not equally, but white America has better accepted the model minority Asians, possibly because it's been without protest nor civil disobedience. Asians are better educated, less violent, higher income, but, on the flipside, haven't held strongly to our cultural identity (as opposed to Latinos/blacks) and becoming white-washed. To clarify, Asian-American immigration history is way different than Latinos/blacks and I'm not necessarily advocating that they should/can go the Asian route.
There's a caveat that you may have missed regarding some the rural white American. A good many didn't come from a comfortable lifestyle in the suburbs. A lot has poverty laced beginnings and elevated their lifestyles as they grew older. The have an understanding of work ethic and appreciation of acquiring an education and working toward a better standard of living. They also have an appreciation of the sacrifices required to earn this improved lifestyle.

And they have a high interest in preserving some of the traditions that made it possible.
 

Cotton

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There's a caveat that you may have missed regarding some the rural white American. A good many didn't come from a comfortable lifestyle in the suburbs. A lot has poverty laced beginnings and elevated their lifestyles as they grew older. The have an understanding of work ethic and appreciation of acquiring an education and working toward a better standard of living. They also have an appreciation of the sacrifices required to earn this improved lifestyle.

And they have a high interest in preserving some of the traditions that made it possible.
This is dead on concerning me. I was raised in a very poor household as a kid and told myself I would never put my kids through that. I busted my ass and made a good life for my family. Held to my traditional values and taught my kids that it's okay to lose. I could go on but I'm on my phone and don't have the energy.
 

data

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There's a caveat that you may have missed regarding some the rural white American. A good many didn't come from a comfortable lifestyle in the suburbs. A lot has poverty laced beginnings and elevated their lifestyles as they grew older. The have an understanding of work ethic and appreciation of acquiring an education and working toward a better standard of living. They also have an appreciation of the sacrifices required to earn this improved lifestyle.

And they have a high interest in preserving some of the traditions that made it possible.
Why did you feel like you had to make that clarification? I don't believe I insinuated that rural whites were a collection of silver spoon-fed exurbanites.

Cuz I full on agree with everything you said. As a result, seeing what they saw on TV had them saying WTF and, I'm guessing, galvanized this widespread mobilization to vote.
 

L.T. Fan

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Why did you feel like you had to make that clarification? I don't believe I insinuated that rural whites were a collection of silver spoon-fed exurbanites.

Cuz I full on agree with everything you said. As a result, seeing what they saw on TV had them saying WTF and, I'm guessing, galvanized this widespread mobilization to vote.
Just thought I would throw that in as a motivation factor that may be representive of the white voting movement that some depict as the hillbilly vote.
 

Cowboysrock55

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Wasn't my point. Why did Trump win? He captured the votes of a woken beast, the rural white vote. I'm neither rural, nor white, so I'm guessing why they woke.

As little as I know about being rural or white, rural white voters know little about urban race relations. Their knowledge is likely from TV and TV was all Kaep, riots, police killings.
I think you under estimate the knowledge level of rural white people. And I don't think electing Trump was some sort of retaliation against black people for BLM. As a white male who has lived in St. Louis and currently lives in rural Missouri (So weird what is considered "Rural," this isn't just farmers uniting, it's small cities) I think most of us are pretty aware of urban race relations.

I don't think this election really had much to do with BLM or cops getting shot. It was more about hate towards the establishment and Hillary. People are sick of a shitty economy that continue to get worse and worse. And I think they were open to trying something different. Hillary had the stank of the same old failure all over her. It's sort of like when your starting QB sucks, the backup is always the most popular guy. Because people would prefer the unknown to what they already know sucks.
 

L.T. Fan

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I think you under estimate the knowledge level of rural white people. And I don't think electing Trump was some sort of retaliation against black people for BLM. As a white male who has lived in St. Louis and currently lives in rural Missouri (So weird what is considered "Rural," this isn't just farmers uniting, it's small cities) I think most of us are pretty aware of urban race relations.

I don't think this election really had much to do with BLM or cops getting shot. It was more about hate towards the establishment and Hillary. People are sick of a shitty economy that continue to get worse and worse. And I think they were open to trying something different. Hillary had the stank of the same old failure all over her. It's sort of like when your starting QB sucks, the backup is always the most popular guy. Because people would prefer the unknown to what they already know sucks.
From my vantage point and the people I am exposed to the most this resonates pretty true.
 

boozeman

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I don't think this election really had much to do with BLM or cops getting shot. It was more about hate towards the establishment and Hillary.
It is quite possibly the first election where "whitey" (I use that to make it easier to describe) felt threatened.

So, they got out and voted. They made their voice heard.

Might have voted for a lunatic, but they did. They got it done.

Any registered voter who didn't like it who didn't vote has that to deal with.

But hopefully, they aren't victims because of their own lack of initiative. But it seems like they are taking the easy way out.

People are sick of a shitty economy that continue to get worse and worse. And I think they were open to trying something different. Hillary had the stank of the same old failure all over her. It's sort of like when your starting QB sucks, the backup is always the most popular guy. Because people would prefer the unknown to what they already know sucks.
Some like the fact that they have a handout from the government.

They can accept and take a job in good faith. These are not great jobs. And no, they won't necessarily pay all the rent that is too damn high. But it is work and it is money. Some people don't even want that. Too much.

They work two days, show up with a wage verification worksheet for food stamps, get it and then disappear. Then at an unemployment hearing, you have them sit there and claim they were "fired" or "laid off".

There is a huge huge subsector of the workforce that play the welfare system to their advantage.

I see that shit every fucking day. So excuse me if I don't bleed for those on the bottom strata of the socio-economic scale.

Until it is stressed that work matters and that accepting subsistence should be temporary and not a lifestyle, I don't know what else to say.
 

Jiggyfly

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What the hell that has to do with what I or skid posted is beyond me. But, the assassinations of cops would be the biggest reason. But, how about we not derail this thread with something that has already been discussed and has jack nor shit to do with what skid posted, and I agreed with.
So you want to have a "discussion" about topics you only want to talk about.

It was not an attack just wanted to know why you felt that way.
 

data

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I think you under estimate the knowledge level of rural white people.
Likely. My only exposure is when the county fair comes around.

As a white male who has lived in St. Louis and currently lives in rural Missouri (So weird what is considered "Rural," this isn't just farmers uniting, it's small cities) I think most of us are pretty aware of urban race relations.
What's the population of the city you live in? How far is it from the nearest major metro area (guessing St.Louis)? Just curious. No agenda.

I don't think this election really had much to do with BLM or cops getting shot. It was more about hate towards the establishment and Hillary. People are sick of a shitty economy that continue to get worse and worse. And I think they were open to trying something different. Hillary had the stank of the same old failure all over her. It's sort of like when your starting QB sucks, the backup is always the most popular guy. Because people would prefer the unknown to what they already know sucks.
Agreed. I don't think race relations is the sole reason for the mobilization. We had a major recession in 2008. Major metro areas seemed to have recovered, but not everyone. Hillary got pulled into Trump's game and didn't set a clear economic recovery agenda. Essentially, her campaign predominantly was "don't vote for that crass bigot."

It's just that TV depicts blacks as protesting shitastic everyday life like every white person was living the life of luxury and rural whites were looking around and saying, "hey, things aren't rosy here, either."
 

junk

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Agreed. I don't think race relations is the sole reason for the mobilization. We had a major recession in 2008. Major metro areas seemed to have recovered, but not everyone. Hillary got pulled into Trump's game and didn't set a clear economic recovery agenda. Essentially, her campaign predominantly was "don't vote for that crass bigot."

It's just that TV depicts blacks as protesting shitastic everyday life like every white person was living the life of luxury and rural whites were looking around and saying, "hey, things aren't rosy here, either."
I actually think it is less about race and more about the appeal of Trump to the average, hard working middle class American. I think the group that turned out in droves for him is probably that group that is typically hard working, but is seeing their way of life (and standard of living) degrading. In many cases, that ends up being rural white voters.

I'm guessing he is appealing to people in the energy industry and manufacturing in particular. The energy side I actually think will be a good thing, particularly coal, which the Democrats have been slowly killing for years, and is still a cheap source of energy for this country. Oil, I still think we should just get it wherever we can get it the cheapest. We have a lot here, we can get it when we need it, so buy it where it is cheap now. If the Saudis want to sell it cheaper than we can produce it, great, we'll buy from there and go get ours when prices go up or everybody else runs. I'm sure that is not what people who make their living in oil want to hear though.

Manufacturing though I think is a massively flawed premise. I'm sure people want to return to the age when we manufacture things here and Dad goes to work at the factory all day making good money. Those days are gone. If businesses can manufacture overseas, they will. If not, they'll just automate factories and the people working there will largely be college educated tech workers anyway. We're not going to make T-shirts, plastic widgets or shoes in this country anymore. Even things like iPhones don't really make sense to manufacture here. So Trump's plan is to limit the economic advantages of manufacturing overseas to what end? Either you end up producing massively overpriced goods domestically (since the average American factory worker isn't going to work for the price a Chinese one would) that you can't sell here and can't export because of the price or you invest to completely automate manufacturing and job creation is limited to a sector that doesn't support the large base that turned out to vote for him.
 

Cowboysrock55

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Likely. My only exposure is when the county fair comes around.



What's the population of the city you live in? How far is it from the nearest major metro area (guessing St.Louis)? Just curious. No agenda.



Agreed. I don't think race relations is the sole reason for the mobilization. We had a major recession in 2008. Major metro areas seemed to have recovered, but not everyone. Hillary got pulled into Trump's game and didn't set a clear economic recovery agenda. Essentially, her campaign predominantly was "don't vote for that crass bigot."

It's just that TV depicts blacks as protesting shitastic everyday life like every white person was living the life of luxury and rural whites were looking around and saying, "hey, things aren't rosy here, either."
About 2 and half hours to St Louis and about the same to Kansas City. Lake of the Ozarks is sort of an odd area. Small populations during winter and massive populations during summer. I guess Camden County is like 43,000.
 
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