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Thread: Teacher: I love my students, I love my job, and I feel fulfilled. But Im broke.

  1. #11
    Senior Member L.T. Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boozeman View Post
    Many have passion. This is not about chasing money. It is about having a real wage that you can live on. And sometimes it is not an enormous amount of money.

    I will never forget going to a chain restaurant and having my son's third grade teacher unexpectedly ending up as our server. She was humiliated and I was angry for her. She was an excellent teacher.

    Funny, we were still capitalists 20-30 years ago, right?
    I hear you but the system operates on limited funding and that is the way it is. If you can come up with a solution I am sure a lot of people will be thankful but it's about money and how it is distributed. Tax based systems simply have limitations and there is little than can be done to change short of increasing the tax base.
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  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiggyfly View Post
    So then who teaches in this scenario?

    I really don't understand how you turn this into a simple treatise about capitalism did you not read any of the actual articles?
    Yes. Did you read what I wrote. The bottom line was money.
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  3. #13
    Senior Member Cowboysrock55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boozeman View Post
    Many have passion. This is not about chasing money. It is about having a real wage that you can live on. And sometimes it is not an enormous amount of money.
    What is considered a living wage work over a 9 month period? Just curious? You'd think if the pay was that horrible that we would see teaching shortages across America. I know a lot of teachers pick up summer jobs or do summer teaching over the summer break. Which frankly they should. I don't have any children in school, so I don't really deal with that first hand. The teachers in my area though seem to be surviving just fine. They own houses, drive cars and aren't failing to earn a living wage.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiggyfly View Post
    So then who teaches in this scenario?

    I really don't understand how you turn this into a simple treatise about capitalism did you not read any of the actual articles?
    You are missing the point. It not a matter of fairness or equity it is a system that is entrenched and is all tied to money. Personal ideologies are just that but it won't solve the root cause of the problem.
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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1bigfan13 View Post
    Oklahoma teachers are near the bottom of US rankings when it comes to teacher salaries. Therefore, the best and brightest from the state typically leave for Texas, Colorado, and other nearby states just so they can make a decent living.

    There's a State Question on this year's OK election ballot for salary increases for teachers. I voted in favor of it and hope it passes. Otherwise the OK school systems will be stuck scraps/leftovers. You get what you pay for.
    That's great. That's also what it takes to change things
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  6. #16
    Senior Member Cowboysrock55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiggyfly View Post

    Average weekly wages (inflation adjusted) of public-sector teachers decreased $30 per week from 1996 to 2015, from $1,122 to $1,092 (in 2015 dollars). In contrast, weekly wages of all college graduates rose from $1,292 to $1,416 over this period.
    So wait, $57,000.00 per year isn't a living wage anymore?

  7. #17
    Senior Member Jiggyfly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by L.T. Fan View Post
    You are missing the point. It not a matter of fairness or equity it is a system that is entrenched and is all tied to money. Personal ideologies are just that but it won't solve the root cause of the problem.
    What does any of that have to do with the question I asked?

    Once again you are ignoring what people are actually concerned about QUALITY TEACHING and babbling about stuff that does not matter.

    Do you care about the quality of the teachers.

  8. #18
    Senior Member Jiggyfly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cowboysrock55 View Post
    What is considered a living wage work over a 9 month period? Just curious? You'd think if the pay was that horrible that we would see teaching shortages across America. I know a lot of teachers pick up summer jobs or do summer teaching over the summer break. Which frankly they should. I don't have any children in school, so I don't really deal with that first hand. The teachers in my area though seem to be surviving just fine. They own houses, drive cars and aren't failing to earn a living wage.
    It's not 9 months it's closer to 10 months and these days teachers have to get training and do lesson planning during the summer.

    And what type of jobs do you think you cn get over the summer that up your yearly income that much?

    And yes people can do everything you listed but after all of that they have nearly no savings.
    Last edited by Jiggyfly; 11-05-2016 at 11:16 PM.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Cowboysrock55's Avatar
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    K-5 teacher overload: Too many trained, not enough jobs
    Emma Beck, USA TODAY 11:14 a.m. EST February 19, 2013
    But shortages remain in math, science and special education.

    elementary school classroom
    (Photo: Charles Rex Arbogast, AP)
    STORY HIGHLIGHTS

    Experts say colleges and universities don't make the effort to match supply and demand
    Budget cuts, hiring freezes and delayed retirements are shrinking the pool of positions
    There were 1,708,057 elementary school teachers in 2010, a decrease from 1,774,295 in 2009
    The nation is training twice as many K-5 elementary school teachers as needed each year, while teacher shortages remain in the content specific areas of math, science and special education.

    Illinois trained roughly 10 teachers for every one position available, according to an estimate by the National Council on Teacher Quality (NCTQ), a Washington based research and policy group.
    In New York, about 6,500 childhood education specialists were trained in 2010 to fill the projected demand of 2,800 in 2011, according to the state's education department and labor bureau.
    Public elementary schools in Cherry Hill, N.J., average 400 to 600 applicants for one full-time position; the numbers are up to 400 for work as a long-term substitute, said George Guy, the principal for A. Russell Knight Elementary School.
    NCTQ president Kate Walsh says the market is "flooded with elementary teachers" because universities and colleges don't make the effort to match supply and demand as other professions might do. Dean Donald Heller of Michigan State's College of Education says it is true that MSU does not coordinate with the state regarding how many elementary school teachers are needed. But the school produces teachers for a nationwide market, not specifically for Michigan, he countered.

    The National Center for Education Statistics reported there were 1,708,057 elementary school teachers in 2010, the most recent year for which statistics are available, a decrease from 1,774,295 in 2009.

    "For those coming out of college, getting a full- time position immediately is not going to happen," Guy said.

    A combination of state budget cuts, hiring freezes and teachers delaying retirement has shrunk the pool of open elementary teacher positions, Guy said. New Jersey Republican Gov. Chris Christie slashed $828 million in 2010 for K-12 school funding in an effort to balance the state's deficit. In Cherry Hill, 70 non-tenured positions were cut; Guy says the district still hasn't recovered.

    The future elementary teacher job outlook may not be as bleak. A 2012 Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) estimates a 17% increase in teacher employment from 2010 to 2020, citing higher enrollment and decline in student-teacher ratios. The growth is expected to be concentrated largely in the South and West, the BLS reports.

    Though the oversupply of elementary education teachers persists, shortages remain in math, science and special education. Content certification in these low-staffed areas requires additional credits and hours, a discouragement for some to pursue the endorsement, said Doug Peden, the executive director of the Ohio based American Association for Employment in Education.

    The Clark County School district in Clark County, Nev., presently holds 36 math vacancies, 22 science vacancies and 92 special education vacancies out of a force of 17,000 teachers, the district's press secretary, Melinda Malone, said.

    The Richland School District Two in Columbia, S.C., has similar perennial shortages for math, science and special education teachers. "We have been able to fill our vacancies However, each year we must work diligently to find suitable applicants," said Karen Lovett, the school district's executive director of human resources.

    Greater communication between universities and school districts would help level supply and demand, said Richelle Patterson, a senior policy analyst at the National Education Association, a labor union that works to advance public education. "If the districts (students) want to work in have no turnover, then school districts should translate that information to (university) preparation programs," she said.

    _______________________________________________

    I think part of this is a supply side as well. If you have too many people with teaching degrees, it suppresses wages.

  10. #20
    Senior Member L.T. Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiggyfly View Post
    What does any of that have to do with the question I asked?

    Once again you are ignoring what people are actually concerned about QUALITY TEACHING and babbling about stuff that does not matter.

    Do you care about the quality of the teachers.
    The quality of the teachers is one topic closely followed by outcry of why they are not compensated as they should be. That is two parts of the same discussion. The passion ideology is fine but artists are passionate and musicians are passoniate as well but that doesn't automatically equate to being properly compensated. Teachers are in a field that unless it is a private system they are locked into a predetermined pay scale. No one is making a case that they shouldn't be better paid it's a matter of distribution of available funds. It is fine to be devoted and passionate but there is another issue in play so that can't just be ignored.
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