The Great Police Work Thread

Jiggyfly

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Bravo to this cop and he deserves all the accolades he gets


http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/19/us/ohi...ect/index.html

(CNN)Police shootings stoke controversy as the public dissects the details of each incident and decides whether the use of force was unwarranted or if the officer acted in self-defense in the face of a truly dangerous criminal.

This isn't one of those cases.

On Thursday, Officer Jesse Kidder could have opened fire on a man in New Richmond, Ohio, and likely would never have heard a breath of the protest that followed the shootings of Eric Harris and Walter Scott.

What might have been a "suicide by cop" ended in the suspect's arrest and booking, thanks to what Kidder's colleagues say was his "great restraint."

If there were a checklist for when it's OK to shoot a suspect, Kidder could have ticked most of the boxes.

Double homicide suspect, check.

Possibly armed, check.

Verbally threatening police, check.

Refusing to remove hands from pockets, check.

Charging at an officer, check.

"Law enforcement officers all across the nation deal with split-second decisions that mean life or death. I wanted to be absolutely sure before I used deadly force," Kidder told CNN affiliate WLWT.

In the incident, caught on Kidder's body camera, the officer gets out of his car, his gun trained on a suspect who had allegedly killed his fiancee and best friend before leading police on a multicounty chase through Kentucky and Ohio.

The officer's body camera -- which Kidder's family bought for him after the Michael Brown shooting in Ferguson, Missouri -- captured the suspect rushing toward Kidder, unfazed by the officer's handgun. Dispatchers had told Kidder the suspect might have a gun under his car seat and might attempt to commit "suicide by cop," WLWT reported.

"I jumped out, and he's running toward me. I had my firearm already drawn on him, and I tell him to put his hands up in the air, and he was screaming, 'Shoot me! Shoot me!'" Kidder said.

Kidder backs away from the suspect, who puts one hand in his jacket pocket, then another. Still, the officer declines to pull the trigger.

"My eyes are watching that hand right now, nothing else," Kidder said.

Kidder yells, "Get your hands out of your pocket now!"

The suspect continues to advance, walking swiftly, hands still obscured.

"I was trying to open a dialogue with him. 'I don't want to shoot you; just get on the ground.' But he wasn't having it. He kept repeating, 'Shoot me!' At one point, he said, 'Shoot me, or I'll shoot you,'" the officer said.

Kidder keeps his composure, even when the suspect charges to within a few feet, forcing Kidder to tumble backward to the ground, his upended feet coming into the body camera's view.

As Kidder gets up, backup arrives and the suspect surrenders, turning around and lying on his face in the street, his arms extended from his body.

Sgt. Les Smith, who has been with the New Richmond police for 33 years, told CNN that even though Kidder is green -- he's been with the department for only about a year -- he's an excellent officer.

The former Marine, who served two tours of duty before joining the force, works as a resource officer for a New Richmond school, and his $400 body camera comes in handy when issues arise there, Smith told CNN.

The video demonstrates that if Kidder had felt compelled to shoot the suspect, he would've been justified, Police Chief Randy Harvey told WLWT, adding that he hopes to find funding to outfit all of his officers with body cameras.

"For him to make the judgment call that he did shows great restraint and maturity," the chief said.
 

Clay_Allison

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Bravo to this cop and he deserves all the accolades he gets


http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/19/us/ohi...ect/index.html

(CNN)Police shootings stoke controversy as the public dissects the details of each incident and decides whether the use of force was unwarranted or if the officer acted in self-defense in the face of a truly dangerous criminal.

This isn't one of those cases.

On Thursday, Officer Jesse Kidder could have opened fire on a man in New Richmond, Ohio, and likely would never have heard a breath of the protest that followed the shootings of Eric Harris and Walter Scott.

What might have been a "suicide by cop" ended in the suspect's arrest and booking, thanks to what Kidder's colleagues say was his "great restraint."

If there were a checklist for when it's OK to shoot a suspect, Kidder could have ticked most of the boxes.

Double homicide suspect, check.

Possibly armed, check.

Verbally threatening police, check.

Refusing to remove hands from pockets, check.

Charging at an officer, check.

"Law enforcement officers all across the nation deal with split-second decisions that mean life or death. I wanted to be absolutely sure before I used deadly force," Kidder told CNN affiliate WLWT.

In the incident, caught on Kidder's body camera, the officer gets out of his car, his gun trained on a suspect who had allegedly killed his fiancee and best friend before leading police on a multicounty chase through Kentucky and Ohio.

The officer's body camera -- which Kidder's family bought for him after the Michael Brown shooting in Ferguson, Missouri -- captured the suspect rushing toward Kidder, unfazed by the officer's handgun. Dispatchers had told Kidder the suspect might have a gun under his car seat and might attempt to commit "suicide by cop," WLWT reported.

"I jumped out, and he's running toward me. I had my firearm already drawn on him, and I tell him to put his hands up in the air, and he was screaming, 'Shoot me! Shoot me!'" Kidder said.

Kidder backs away from the suspect, who puts one hand in his jacket pocket, then another. Still, the officer declines to pull the trigger.

"My eyes are watching that hand right now, nothing else," Kidder said.

Kidder yells, "Get your hands out of your pocket now!"

The suspect continues to advance, walking swiftly, hands still obscured.

"I was trying to open a dialogue with him. 'I don't want to shoot you; just get on the ground.' But he wasn't having it. He kept repeating, 'Shoot me!' At one point, he said, 'Shoot me, or I'll shoot you,'" the officer said.

Kidder keeps his composure, even when the suspect charges to within a few feet, forcing Kidder to tumble backward to the ground, his upended feet coming into the body camera's view.

As Kidder gets up, backup arrives and the suspect surrenders, turning around and lying on his face in the street, his arms extended from his body.

Sgt. Les Smith, who has been with the New Richmond police for 33 years, told CNN that even though Kidder is green -- he's been with the department for only about a year -- he's an excellent officer.

The former Marine, who served two tours of duty before joining the force, works as a resource officer for a New Richmond school, and his $400 body camera comes in handy when issues arise there, Smith told CNN.

The video demonstrates that if Kidder had felt compelled to shoot the suspect, he would've been justified, Police Chief Randy Harvey told WLWT, adding that he hopes to find funding to outfit all of his officers with body cameras.

"For him to make the judgment call that he did shows great restraint and maturity," the chief said.
I'll criticize cops when I think it's necessary (note for the record I said Wilson was not guilty of any crime) but I'd have killed that fool all kinds of dead and I wouldn't blame any cop for doing so. Savvy read of the situation by the cop.
 

Cowboysrock55

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Six officers charged in death of Freddie Gray

The Baltimore Sun
contact the reporters Trials and Arbitration Homicide Freddie Gray Nick Mosby Marilyn Mosby Jesse Jackson Inner Harbor

Six officers charged criminally in death of Freddie Gray
Charges against police in Freddie Gray's death prompted celebrations but also concern around West Baltimore.
Here's what Marilyn Mosby said about calls for her to appoint an independent prosecutor in Freddie Gray's deat
The six Baltimore police officers involved in the arrest of Freddie Gray – who died last month after being injured in police custody – have been charged criminally, State's Attorney Marilyn Mosby announced Friday.

Mosby's announcement on the steps of the War Memorial Building was greeted with cheers and applause. Mosby said she told Gray's family that "no one is above the law and I would pursue justice upon their behalf."

Desmond Taylor, 29, shouted in jubilee in front of the War Memorial Building.

Mosby: Freddie Gray's death a homicide, officers charged
Investigation and medical examiner reports say Freddie Gray's death a homicide. Baltimore City State's Attorney Marilyn J. Mosby will file charges against all 6 officers involved in the arrest. (Baltimore Sun)
"I did not expect this, but I prayed for it," he said. "This day means that your actions bring consequences in Baltimore City."

Word traveled quickly of the charges against the officers. In West Baltimore, cars honked their horns. A man hanging out of a truck window pumped his fists and yelled; "Justice! Justice! Justice!"

At the corner where Gray was arrested, 53-year-old Willie Rooks held his hands up in peace signs and screamed, "Justice!"

Reacting to news of the charges, President Barack Obama called it "absolutely vital that the truth come out.

"What I think the people of Baltimore want more than anything else is the truth," the president said. "That's what people around the country expect."


Officer Caesar Goodson Jr., 45, who was the driver of a police van that carried Gray through the streets of Baltimore, was charged with second-degree murder, manslaughter, second-degree assault, two vehicular manslaughter charges and misconduct in office. A man who answered the phone at Goodson's home declined to comment and hung up the phone.

Officer William Porter, 25, was charged with involuntary manslaughter, second-degree assault and misconduct in office.

Lt. Brian Rice, 41, was charged with involuntary manslaughter, second-degree assault and misconduct in office.

Sgt. Alicia White, 30, was charged with involuntary manslaughter, second-degree assault and misconduct in office.

Officer Edward Nero, 29, was charged with second-degree assault and misconduct in office.

Officer Garrett Miller, 26, was charged with second-degree assault, misconduct in office and false imprisonment.

If convicted of all charges, Goodson would face up to 63 years in prison. Rice would face up to 30 years and Porter, Nero, Miller and White would face up to 20 years.

Warrants were issued for the arrest of all six officers. It wasn't immediately clear where the officers were Friday morning.

Man who shot Freddie Gray arrest video thanks Marilyn Mosby
Kevin Moore, who shot video of Freddie Gray's arrest, shows his support for City State's Attorney Marilyn Mosby's decision to charge the officers involved in Gray's death. (Julie Scharper/Baltimore Sun)
"We're not sure what time they are coming in. They will go through the process like anyone else," said Gerard Shields, a spokesman for the department of Public Safety and Correctional Services.

After the officers are arrested they will go to Baltimore Central Booking and Intake Center downtown to be processed and where they will have their bail set by a court commissioner within 24 hours. If they are not released or cannot post bail, they will go before a judge in District Court the next business day.

If they are held, Shields wouldn't say where they would be placed in the jail, citing "security reasons."

Gray, 25, was chased down and arrested by Baltimore officers on April 12 and died a week later. His family has said he suffered a spinal cord injury and a crushed voice box.

Just before Mosby announced the criminal charges, the Fraternal Order of Police defended the officers involved.

"Not one of the officers involved in this tragic situation left home in the morning with the anticipation that someone with whom they interacted would not go home that night," Gene Ryan, president of FOP Lodge 3, wrote in a letter to Mosby. "As tragic as this situation is, none of the officers involved are responsible for the death of Mr. Gray."

After bystander video of the April 12 arrest surfaced, showing Gray dragging his feet as he was put in a police transport van, there have been cries for charges against the officers.

Mosby said Gray was improperly arrested because officers had no probable cause to detain him. Officers found a knife in Gray's pants, but it was not a switchblade, as police previously said, and was legal under Maryland law.

In a detailed recounting of the events, Mosby described Gray being repeatedly denied medical attention by police officers, even as he asked for medical help and later was unresponsive in a police van.

Gray suffered a "severe and critical neck injury" as a result of being handcuffed, shackled and being unrestrained in the van.

Mosby said an investigation found officers placed Gray in wrist and ankle restraints and left him stomach-down on the floor of a police van as they drove around West Baltimore. Despite his repeated requests for medical attention, they did not provide it and continued to drive without securing him in the van, she said.

Officers on at least five occasions placed Gray in the van or checked on him and failed to secure him, she said. By the time they reached the Western District police station, he was not breathing and was in cardiac arrest, she said.

Mosby said her office did a "comprehensive, thorough and independent" investigation that began April 13, the day after Gray was injured.

"My team worked around the clock, 12- and 14-hour days," she said.


Mosby worked quickly in filing charges. Baltimore Police handed over their investigation to her office Thursday, one day earlier than they had promised.

The Fraternal Order of Police asked Mosby to appoint an independent prosecutor in the case, citing her ties to the Gray family's attorney, William Murphy, as well as her lead prosecutor's connections to members of the local media. Murphy donated $5,000 to Mosby's campaign and served on her transition committee.

"While I have the utmost respect for you and your office, I have very deep concerns about the many conflicts of interest presented by your office conducting an investigation in this case," Ryan wrote in his letter.

The FOP letter also expresses concerns regarding Mosby's marriage to Baltimore City Councilman Nick Mosby.

"Most importantly, it is clear that your husband's political future will be directly impacted, for better or worse, by the outcome of your investigation," the letter states. "In order to avoid any appearance of impropriety or a violation of the Professional Rules of Professional Responsibility, I ask that you appoint a Special Prosecutor to determine whether or not any charges should be filed."


Mosby responded to that request by saying: "The people of Baltimore City elected me and there is no accountability with a special prosecutor."

"I will prosecute any case within my jurisdiction," she added.

Following Gray's death, demonstrations and protests began peacefully but turned violent on Saturday and Monday. Monday's events included rioting, arson and property damage in pockets of the city.

Officials responded by declaring a state of emergency, instituting a nightly curfew and calling in help from state troopers and the Maryland National Guard.

Mosby called on the public to remain calm.

"I heard your call for 'no justice, no peace,'" she said. "Your peace is sincerely needed as I work to deliver justice on behalf of this young man."

Demonstrations were planned in Baltimore for Friday night and Saturday, well before Mosby made her announcement of criminal charges against the officers.

A group called the Bmore United Coalition plans to meet at the state's attorney's office at 3 p.m. and march to City Hall. The People's Power Assembly plans a protest at the Inner Harbor at 5 p.m.

Baltimore Mayor Stephanie Rawlings-Blake is expected to address the criminal charges against the officers at 1 p.m.

Gov. Larry Hogan, who has been in Baltimore all week, said he had no immediate reaction to the officers being charged. He said his sole job is to keep the peace.

Hogan said he has faith in the justice system and his primary goal is to urge people to react peacefully.

Baltimore City Councilwoman Helen Holton called Friday's announcement of charges "a defining moment for Baltimore. We should all be proud."

"This is a good day," she said. "I'm excited for my city. This speaks to decades of problems we have faced in this city and we're beginning a new chapter today into real justice. This will allow us to begin to address the systemic problems that make us a tale of two cities."

The Rev. Jesse Jackson said Mosby deserves to be congratulated but cautioned the criminal charges are only a start to a "lengthy process."

Shouts of "thank you" and "hallelujah" broke out among bystanders who pressed as close as they could to the media scrum around Mosby.

"I got hugged by someone I don't even know," said Kristyn Porter, 23, of East Baltimore.

Porter had business nearby but when she heard the announcement would be made at War Memorial, she stopped to listen.

"I'm happy justice was served, and things can calm down now," Porter, who works in security, said. "The only other thing people are angry about is the curfew."

She and her friend, and Raquel Burke, 23, also of the East Side, said they hadn't been able to attend any of the marches so far.

"Now I want to go to this one," said Burke, eyeing a flyer someone gave her for a rally at City Hall at 2 p.m. on Saturday.

Reactions on the streets were a mix of celebration and lingering concern.

In Gilmor Homes, the neighborhood where Gray was arrested, things were quiet Friday, with a police helicopter circling overhead. At the intersection of North Avenue and Pennsylvania Avenue, the focus of rioting Monday and demonstrations all week, traffic moved through with many motorists honking their horns.

Meecah Tucker, 23, wearing a T-shirt that read, "I Bleed Baltimore," said: "If it was one of us doing that against a police officer, it would be first-degree murder."

Waiting to catch a bus near the Western District Police Station, Joann El-Amin said her husband called to give her the news about the officers being charged. "Everyone should be punished if they did something wrong," she said.

But she wasn't keen on the protests that turned violent.

"I just wish they'd stop this foolishness; the people tearing up their own neighborhoods. It makes no sense. I told my son, who works downtown, to go home and not get caught up in it. ...You don't know if the crowd is peaceful or full of foolish people. I didn't need to protest. I knew it would come out in the wash," she said.

Dwayne Wright, 44, said: "An indictment is not a conviction. They had to do something. I definitely feel leaders could have done it in other cases."

Michael Hall, 52, said he hoped the charges weren't filed just in an attempt to calm violence in the city.


"I hope she doesn't pin it on one of them when it's time for trial," he said. "Are they gonna stick by these charges?"

Ronald Blake, a special project manager for the city's Housing Authority, attended Friday morning's announcement. He said he was not surprised that all six officers were charged.

"I think they wanted to make this decision to more move on. That's the concern now, what will people do with information? Now I am concerned about the police and how that will impact them and their safety," he said.

This story will be updated.

Baltimore Sun reporters Yvonne Wenger, Meredith Cohn, Erica L. Green, Jessica Anderson, Kevin Rector, Erin Cox, Justin Fenton, Mark Puente, Doug Donovan, Liz Bowie, John Fritze, Jean Marbella and Alison Knezevich contributed to this report.

pwood@baltsun.com

twitter.com/pwoodreporter

Copyright © 2015, The Baltimore Sun
 
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Jiggyfly

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'Baltimore Sun' Probe Exposes 'Disturbing Pattern' Of Police Brutality
APRIL 30, 2015 5:15 AM ET

Renee Montagne talks to Mark Puentes, of The Baltimore Sun, whose investigation revealed the city paid about $5.7 million over 4 years to settle suits from citizens accusing police of excessive force.

RENEE MONTAGNE, HOST:

Here's one more dimension of Freddie Gray's story. His arrest and death comes amid a long-standing pattern of police violence. Last fall, a Baltimore Sun investigation revealed what it called, a disturbing pattern of police brutality. The city paid out more than five and a half million dollars to more than 100 victims of police beatings that occurred between 2008 and 2011. Nearly all were never charged with a crime or had their charges dismissed. Baltimore Sun reporter Mark Puente wrote the two-part series.

Good morning.

MARK PUENTE: Good morning.

MONTAGNE: Now, was there a single incident that got the Sun, the Baltimore Sun, going on this story?

PUENTE: No, the Baltimore Sun recruited me and asked me, hey, just check out - we've been hearing about police brutality for some time. Go see what you can find. I spent six months combing through thousands of court documents, dozens and dozens of hours of recordings of trial testimony. And then what we found was similarities emerged pretty quick on some of these alleged beatings by officers on Baltimore residents.

MONTAGNE: And sketch out for us just a couple of examples of the sorts of victims and their injuries that you found.

PUENTE: An 87-year-old grandmother by the name of Venus Green, a retired educator, whose grandson was shot down the street at a party store - he stumbled in the house asking for help. She called police. She received a broken arm by an officer when he came into her house and accused her of allowing the shooting to happen in the basement of her home. She collected, I recall, $100,000 when she sued.

A 26-year-old pregnant accountant was thrown to the ground. She received a $125,000. The people we focused on who received these settlements weren't drug dealers. They weren't people out robbing or stealing. It was citizens who called the police for help. In many cases, they were questionable arrests.

MONTAGNE: You focused on a particular police unit there called the Violent Crimes Impact section. Why did you end up focusing on them in particular?

PUENTE: Because all the people that we spoke to in our investigation mentioned this group. They were plainclothes. They weren't dressed like police officers. They wore sweatshirts, baseball hats. And people had no idea they were officers until they put them in handcuffs and these alleged incidents occurred.

MONTAGNE: And give us one example of the sorts of experiences people had when they ran into this group.

PUENTE: One individual, who collected $200,000, was in a carryout store. He thought he was being robbed until they put handcuffs on him. Next thing you know, when he kind of resisted - hey, who are you? - he got smashed in the face with a police radio. He sues the city. The officer gets on the stand - and I watched the recording of it - and the officer says, hey, I put this man in custody. I have no idea how his injuries occurred. His sergeant gets on the stand and says, I can't recall the incident. He received $200,000.

MONTAGNE: In this series, you know, how often did you find that the police report did not reflect what ultimately was judged to be the real story?

PUENTE: The police reports did not reflect what the lawsuits alleged. But what jumped out was in all - most nearly all the police reports and charging documents, they use the same language - the suspect became defensive. The suspect went after the officer. The officer had to defend his safety and protect his life.

In one example, Officer Michael McSpadden said that an individual jumped off a stool and the officer had to defend himself - punched him, knocked him out and then handcuffed the suspect. We unearthed the video in the 11th hour of the series that showed the individual getting assaulted, falling on the ground and the camera picks - showed the officer picking the man up with his hands clearly cuffed behind his back.

MONTAGNE: He had his hands already cuffed behind his back...

PUENTE: Right.

MONTAGNE: ...And then the officer started hitting him.

PUENTE: That's right.

MONTAGNE: Given that so many of these victims in your investigation were African-American, did they feel they were targeted because they were black? And I'm asking that because there are quite a few black officers in the Baltimore police.

PUENTE: They did feel they were targeted because they were black, but it didn't matter if it was a black officer or a white officer. They have a majority-minority department. They see the blue uniform. Whether it's a white officer or a black officer, they were coming after them because of their poor status in the poorest neighborhoods in the city.

MONTAGNE: So in a sense, what you're saying is these people who were victims were the victims of blue officers (laughter) that is to say...

PUENTE: Right.

MONTAGNE: ...Someone in a uniform.

PUENTE: Correct.

MONTAGNE: In fairness, much of the police brutality cited in your investigation took place before the current police commissioner - his name is Anthony Batts - took over in late 2012. Have things gotten better overall in these last couple of years - or in fact, this latest example that's now known by the entire nation - Freddie Gray - is that a sign that not much has changed?

PUENTE: Well, I don't think it's just the Gray case. That's why I requested all the lawsuits that were filed in 2013 and '14 because the commissioner said, you looked at old cases. Well, there was still 156 new lawsuits filed in '13 and '14 with similar allegations. A case popped up last summer where a uniformed officer was beating a man in a bus stop. That was caught on camera and social media. So these problems still exist. They might not be as high in numbers, but they haven't went away.

MONTAGNE: Well, thank you very much for joining us.

PUENTE: Thank you.

MONTAGNE: Mark Puente is a reporter for the Baltimore Sun.
 

L.T. Fan

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OLD yes but still valid. I think the more pressing issue is not just police violence but targeted violence. The issues thst have given rise to most civil disobedence in this question is whether there is more police brutality toward the black population. Somehow this needs to be intelligently addressed and answered.
 

townsend

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That video uses "complaints with merit" to screen down 92% of complaints. I call bullshit. The people screening these complaints will naturally be biased towards officers.
In the wake of municipalities acting like 3rd world countries (such as Ferguson) internal review saying a complaint is without merit is near meaningless. Also how many complaints were issued by people who were straight up murdered but didn't get the murder recorded by a brave citizen. Garner, and Gray may have never been noticed if not for a guy with a camera. Complaints don't necessarily account for all police brutality incidents.

Game numbers hard enough you can make anything seem insignificant.
 

Jiggyfly

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That video uses "complaints with merit" to screen down 92% of complaints. I call bullshit. The people screening these complaints will naturally be biased towards officers.
In the wake of municipalities acting like 3rd world countries (such as Ferguson) internal review saying a complaint is without merit is near meaningless. Also how many complaints were issued by people who were straight up murdered but didn't get the murder recorded by a brave citizen. Garner, and Gray may have never been noticed if not for a guy with a camera. Complaints don't necessarily account for all police brutality incidents.

Game numbers hard enough you can make anything seem insignificant.
Yep.
 

Cowboysrock55

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That video uses "complaints with merit" to screen down 92% of complaints. I call bullshit. The people screening these complaints will naturally be biased towards officers.
In the wake of municipalities acting like 3rd world countries (such as Ferguson) internal review saying a complaint is without merit is near meaningless. Also how many complaints were issued by people who were straight up murdered but didn't get the murder recorded by a brave citizen. Garner, and Gray may have never been noticed if not for a guy with a camera. Complaints don't necessarily account for all police brutality incidents.

Game numbers hard enough you can make anything seem insignificant.
Technically Gray didn't file a complaint, so it isn't in the statistics...
 

Jiggyfly

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I been watching Hannity to see how he was going to argue the Baltimore incident.

He has gone from don't rush to judgement, to accusing Grey of ingesting Heroine and then somehow breaking his own neck because of the reaction to the drug based on "Police Accounts".:lol

And the way he ran with the "leak" that Grey was harming himself in the police van and that snapped his neck was embarrassing even for me.


Yeah fair and balanced.:lol
 
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Clay_Allison

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I posted a youtube video showing how aggressive cops get when you try to ask questions about filing a complaint last time that B.S. exercise in gaming numbers was posted. I wouldn't do it without a lawyer and a news crew present.
 

fortsbest

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I posted a youtube video showing how aggressive cops get when you try to ask questions about filing a complaint last time that B.S. exercise in gaming numbers was posted. I wouldn't do it without a lawyer and a news crew present.
I won't deny the numbers aren't exactly accurate, but they are far more representative of the truth than what you see on the news every day and are led to believe because of it. For every Ferguson or Freddie Gray, you have hundreds of thousands of police interactions that are appropriate and end well.
 

Clay_Allison

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I won't deny the numbers aren't exactly accurate, but they are far more representative of the truth than what you see on the news every day and are led to believe because of it. For every Ferguson or Freddie Gray, you have hundreds of thousands of police interactions that are appropriate and end well.
Problem is when a department is bad, the good ones can't fix them because they are in different places. Crying about how misunderstood cops in Pittsburgh are when Baltimore is being run like a 3rd world country doesn't help much. You're sticking to a broken narrative about police violence being about isolated incidents rather than departments where a cultural corruption has taken hold. Baltimore paying out more than 5.3 million to victims of police brutality over 4 years illustrates that pretty clearly. That's what gets a city so pissed off that they riot once a straw finally breaks the camel's back.
 

fortsbest

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That my friend is Not entirely true. Rioters like some of those involved will go where ever they can to create a scene. As they did in Baltimore. They had several days of peaceful protests until outsiders and agitators came in and really stirred things up. And cities do business in such a way that money paid out to citizens isn't always representative of a problem as much as it is cheaper to pay people to go away. It happens here in Fort Worth and I'm sure it happens elsewhere.
And why is it you never here about how bad a department is until one incident like this happens and suddenly the whole department is rampant with bad cops? I say again, it's a few cops that cause problems and it reflects on everyone. And just so I remain consistent, there has been no ruling on this one way or other yet.
Lastly, why is it only the conservative media and LE supporters are talking about this state prosecutor who obviously has ties to the legal counsel for the family and how the hell can she file massively impossible charges on the officers the within 24 hours of receiving the packet from PD?

To Jiggs,
I haven't heard him say anything other than we still have to wait for all the evidence to come out, but he did interview a supposed Baltimore cop who I believe said these things are either reported or in evidence. And there is also the guy who was in the other side of the van at the same time who has made statements that it sounded like he was throwing himself around in the back of the van. I will tell you we have people all the time who slam their heads into windows or the cages in cars to avoid going to the jail because they know they go to the hospital first. So is the guy in the back of the van a liar too? Or should we wait and see. I will tell you based on the charges filed, there won't be any guilty verdicts. No way they get second degree murder. But as the prosecutor said in her political speech, "To the youth of this country, I have heard you. This is our time!" Or some such. Really, from a prosecutor?
 

townsend

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That my friend is Not entirely true. Rioters like some of those involved will go where ever they can to create a scene. As they did in Baltimore. They had several days of peaceful protests until outsiders and agitators came in and really stirred things up. And cities do business in such a way that money paid out to citizens isn't always representative of a problem as much as it is cheaper to pay people to go away. It happens here in Fort Worth and I'm sure it happens elsewhere.
And why is it you never here about how bad a department is until one incident like this happens and suddenly the whole department is rampant with bad cops? I say again, it's a few cops that cause problems and it reflects on everyone. And just so I remain consistent, there has been no ruling on this one way or other yet.
Lastly, why is it only the conservative media and LE supporters are talking about this state prosecutor who obviously has ties to the legal counsel for the family and how the hell can she file massively impossible charges on the officers the within 24 hours of receiving the packet from PD?
Here's an expose' of the police brutality in Baltimore. I'm certain there are people who also game the system and get settlements to avoid headaches, but there's a well documented culture of abuse in Baltimore.
http://data.baltimoresun.com/news/police-settlements/

Outrage is a powerful thing. One death can spark up a group of people who know they're being oppressed. Just like in Ferguson, where the behavior of the officers was beyond any kind of corrupt, but really a highly organized/state approved criminal organization. Decades of oppression are hard for people to organize against, whereas a police shooting someone can get people angry, and make them rally. I challenge you to read the DOJ report on Ferguson. (http://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releases/attachments/2015/03/04/ferguson_police_department_report.pdf) and not be disgusted by the organized corruption that not only reflects on all of the officers but the entire legal system in the area.

I think the most important factor is that it's not really a conflict of interest for the DA to be on the side of the victim. In Ferguson when that DA was part of an organization that raised money for the defense, it was. But the DA is supposed to seek a conviction. Also the case is open and shut. Guy was healthy, police detained him with force, guy died. There's no way that man suffers injuries badly enough to die while in custody without all 6 of the officers being complicit in his death. It may be manslaughter but if 6 civilians kidnapped a person (which this was equivalent to since there were no grounds for arrest) and he died because of it, those people would have been rightly prosecuted for that persons death.
 

Jiggyfly

Banned
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
9,220
To Jiggs,
I haven't heard him say anything other than we still have to wait for all the evidence to come out, but he did interview a supposed Baltimore cop who I believe said these things are either reported or in evidence. And there is also the guy who was in the other side of the van at the same time who has made statements that it sounded like he was throwing himself around in the back of the van. I will tell you we have people all the time who slam their heads into windows or the cages in cars to avoid going to the jail because they know they go to the hospital first. So is the guy in the back of the van a liar too? Or should we wait and see. I will tell you based on the charges filed, there won't be any guilty verdicts. No way they get second degree murder. But as the prosecutor said in her political speech, "To the youth of this country, I have heard you. This is our time!" Or some such. Really, from a prosecutor?
He either never made those statements or recanted them but as soon as the "leak" hit Hannity was all on it instead of"waiting for the facts" which he was telling everybody to do in every other instance.

How many of those people had there spinal cord severed Forts?

And the fact that you say you only heard him say wait for all the evidence is comical he is most certainly pushing a agenda here.

Just maybe the cops leaked this story to cover there ass is that totally implausible in your mind?
 

fortsbest

DCC 4Life
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
3,733
Hannity has interviewed everyone from a cop who says he knows the others to Freddie Gray's bondman. While he does have an affinity for police he does present sides CNN, MSNBC and others don't. But someone has to with people like you seem to be who already have their minds made up. These cops may well be bad and Baltimore may well be a cesspool, but it will all come out in the trial. But the black lives matter and hands up don't shoot crowd would rather these cops got hung straight away.
As typical in these circumstance you are arguing form the stance that they are already guilty. Towns says Baltimore is a a shit hole so naturally every cop there is bad in that crowds mind. And with this case, it isn't just "whitey kills a black kid, it's cops in general" because 3 of them are black.
 
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