2016 POTUS Election Thread

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townsend

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The younger candidates were too young for Vietnam. No real conflicts in mid 70's - '80's. Desert Storm in early '90's but draft was long gone and it was all enlisted and National Guard. Not a lot made the military then a profession.
So your saying is since no one has been pressed into service since Nam all of the Ivy League dandies aren't going to end up in the military because it's difficult and unprofitable. This isn't unique to Republicans, it's just they're the ones that lie to lead us into costly wars and ignore the broken vets that return from them.


I don't think they are 'war crazy'. Many just still believe in Reagan's philosophy of peace through strength. And they are still better than the Dem candidates of former President wife and bat crazy self-proclaimed socialist.
There's Rand. End of list. Sanders is the only guy who could get elected who won't lead us into another stupid quagmire. Rubio, Cruz, and even Clinton are all probably chomping at the bit to waste another 10 thousand soldiers and 10 trillion dollars.
And criticize Sanders socialism all you like, (I do) but at least he's a guy who knows how to work with congress, unlike Cruz who threatens to shut down the government every time he spills his pudding.
Also Sanders is probably the only guy with an interest in anti trust legislation. Which seems like a big deal no one is talking about. Corporations are increasingly monopolistic and the middle class is suffering for it. That economic model is more broken than democratic socialism.
 

Cowboysrock55

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The "Welfare Queen" is a tired propaganda tool, analogous to the refugee terrorist or rapist immigrant that Trump speaks of.
You're not dumb, don't say things that are blatantly untrue because they discourage the democratic party. Democrats are just as imperfect as republicans. To pretend that welfare queens are the same as those things is ridiculous. Welfare queens are all around you. I know you aren't dumb enough to believe what you're saying. You're not gaining Bernie votes by making this stuff up.
 

townsend

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You're not dumb, don't say things that are blatantly untrue because they discourage the democratic party. Democrats are just as imperfect as republicans.
They really aren't. I have to question the sanity of anyone that would defend the current state of the party. I considered 2012 a weak field politically, but I would vote for Romney over the field. Democrat or Republican. I mean for the love of God. Are you such a Republican homer that you're willing to vote against ALL of your interests? Rand Paul is getting 2.5% of your party's support. The other 97% side with folks unfit to hold public office.

To pretend that welfare queens are the same as those things is ridiculous. Welfare queens are all around you. I know you aren't dumb enough to believe what you're saying. You're not gaining Bernie votes by making this stuff up.
Obviously welfare fraud exists, but as a percentage of welfare recipients it's low. This "welfare queen" is a caricature that's meant to outrage people. I'm sure there are rapist immigrants out there too, the difference is pretending they are a commonplace, or average.
 

Cowboysrock55

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Obviously welfare fraud exists, but as a percentage of welfare recipients it's low. This "welfare queen" is a caricature that's meant to outrage people. I'm sure there are rapist immigrants out there too, the difference is pretending they are a commonplace, or average.
Welfare queens aren't necessarily committing welfare fraud. Maybe that's where your confusion is. Abusing the system simply means the system is set up wrong. Which it is. It is a common place that people abuse the welfare system. I guess I don't know what you really do for a living so maybe you're shielded from that sort of thing and really do believe the propaganda that says this stuff is as rare as the boogie man. I can tell you first hand it is extremely common.

Now welfare fraud is different. That implies that someone is circumventing the welfare system and receiving welfare money that they aren't entitled to. This also happens but it probably more rare then the other type I mentioned above. The fraud you really see is misreported income. I'm guessing the most common situation is the person who receives welfare and also has an income that is unreported (Cash tips, construction workers who get paid in cash). This is a type of welfare fraud that is fairly common. And at a much higher rate then the immigrant rapist and other bullshit.

By the way some of those same questions could be asked of you. Are you such a Democratic homer that you are willing to vote for someone unfit to hold the presidency such as Hilary Clinton? By the way, I'm probably voting Rand Paul regardless. At least I know I'm voting for the right person. Even if the rest of American is treating this as some sort of a football game where they are rooting either for the blue team or the red team and don't give a shit who the player is for that particular team.
 

L.T. Fan

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Welfare queens aren't necessarily committing welfare fraud. Maybe that's where your confusion is. Abusing the system simply means the system is set up wrong. Which it is. It is a common place that people abuse the welfare system. I guess I don't know what you really do for a living so maybe you're shielded from that sort of thing and really do believe the propaganda that says this stuff is as rare as the boogie man. I can tell you first hand it is extremely common.

Now welfare fraud is different. That implies that someone is circumventing the welfare system and receiving welfare money that they aren't entitled to. This also happens but it probably more rare then the other type I mentioned above. The fraud you really see is misreported income. I'm guessing the most common situation is the person who receives welfare and also has an income that is unreported (Cash tips, construction workers who get paid in cash). This is a type of welfare fraud that is fairly common. And at a much higher rate then the immigrant rapist and other bullshit.

By the way some of those same questions could be asked of you. Are you such a Democratic homer that you are willing to vote for someone unfit to hold the presidency such as Hilary Clinton? By the way, I'm probably voting Rand Paul regardless. At least I know I'm voting for the right person. Even if the rest of American is treating this as some sort of a football game where they are rooting either for the blue team or the red team and don't give a shit who the player is for that particular team.
If very many voters take the approach you do it almost guarantees a Clinton shoo in. Write in voting is akin to 3rd party balloting.
 

BipolarFuk

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Hilary is unfit? :lol

How about all the bums with no experience running for the (R)? Oh, but since it isn't Obama, it is OK. :rofl
 

Kbrown

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If very many voters take the approach you do it almost guarantees a Clinton shoo in. Write in voting is akin to 3rd party balloting.
Don't not vote.
Don't write in or vote third party.
Choose between whatever schmo crawls out of the Republican race and Hillary Clinton.

Too bad all our fighting men died for this bullshit.
 

Kbrown

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I worked in HUD intake for a while, and I saw plenty of people with questionable disabilities receiving SSI and what not, but I never saw a person living high on the hog from welfare. I saw people living off of it and just generally not having direction in life, but I certainly would not trade places with them, and I don't exactly live a glamorous life myself.

I consider myself a conservative, but I still am not sure what is un-conservative about addressing the shrinking middle class, the disparity of wealth, etc. Corporate cronyism and a Cold War-minded military budget is more of a suck on the system than any supposed welfare queen ever was.
 

L.T. Fan

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Hilary is unfit? :lol

How about all the bums with no experience running for the (R)? Oh, but since it isn't Obama, it is OK. :rofl
The office of the president needs as the greatest requirement executive experience and qualification as such. She has little.
 

L.T. Fan

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Don't not vote.
Don't write in or vote third party.
Choose between whatever schmo crawls out of the Republican race and Hillary Clinton.

Too bad all our fighting men died for this bullshit.
The fighting men gave their service to the country and its citizens not the office of the presidency or congress.
 

Cowboysrock55

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Hilary is unfit? :lol

How about all the bums with no experience running for the (R)? Oh, but since it isn't Obama, it is OK. :rofl
One candidate being unfit doesn't make another candidate any more fit. So because Trump is unfit to be president that somehow makes Hilary fit? :dunce
 

Cowboysrock55

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If very many voters take the approach you do it almost guarantees a Clinton shoo in. Write in voting is akin to 3rd party balloting.
Unless of course the Hilary voters take the same approach.

I realize not everyone will follow my belief on that though. Hell it's not like my vote will have any impact on this election. Just like your vote won't either. You could vote for any candidate and the ultimate outcome will be exactly the same. So why not put my vote towards the person I actually believe is best for the job as opposed to the guy who got the most financial backing from the rich people in their political party?
 

L.T. Fan

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Unless of course the Hilary voters take the same approach.

I realize not everyone will follow my belief on that though. Hell it's not like my vote will have any impact on this election. Just like your vote won't either. You could vote for any candidate and the ultimate outcome will be exactly the same. So why not put my vote towards the person I actually believe is best for the job as opposed to the guy who got the most financial backing from the rich people in their political party?
The system doesn't work that way. Write in votes are essentially throw away votes. One can either vote for someone or vote against someone but that only works with the two party system. Anything else is off to no man's land and potentially helps a candidate get in that you didn't want to win.
 

Cowboysrock55

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The system doesn't work that way. Write in votes are essentially throw away votes. One can either vote for someone or vote against someone but that only works with the two party system. Anything else is off to no man's land and potentially helps a candidate get in that you didn't want to win.
By that same logic why bother voting at all LT. Your vote isn't going to decide the election one way or the other. So your vote is basically a throw away vote no matter who you vote for.
 

L.T. Fan

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By that same logic why bother voting at all LT. Your vote isn't going to decide the election one way or the other. So your vote is basically a throw away vote no matter who you vote for.
You are mistaken. If I vote for what I consider to be the lesser of two evils thereby boosting that individual's chances of defeating the one I do not want in then my vote helps determine that outcome.
 

Kbrown

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The fighting men gave their service to the country and its citizens not the office of the presidency or congress.
That was my point. People died in part to keep our elections free, and now I'm told anything aside from choosing between two horrendous candidates is "throwing my vote away."

Rand Paul won't win, but perhaps a person like CRock will sleep better knowing that the sacrifices made to keep us free didn't lead to a scenario where he feels forced to vote for one d-bag out of fear of the other d-bag.

Your mindset also perpetuates the system as it stands.
 

Cowboysrock55

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You are mistaken. If I vote for what I consider to be the lesser of two evils thereby boosting that individual's chances of defeating the one I do not want in then my vote helps determine that outcome.
If the same person wins regardless of your voting choice, by definition your vote didn't matter. It's the same concept as to why you think it's silly for me to vote for someone who isn't one of the top 2.
 

L.T. Fan

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If the same person wins regardless of your voting choice, by definition your vote didn't matter. It's the same concept as to why you think it's silly for me to vote for someone who isn't one of the top 2.
But it did matter. It helped keep the one I didn't want to win out. That's how the two party system works. You either want someone in or you want to keep someone out. Either way my vote would count.
 

Cowboysrock55

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But it did matter. It helped keep the one I didn't want to win out. That's how the two party system works. You either want someone in or you want to keep someone out. Either way my vote would count.
So would my vote, even of it isn't going to Hilary or Donald. You're equating voting for a losing candidate with a vote not counting. Truth is they count exactly the same. Neither vote is going to change this election.
 

L.T. Fan

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So would my vote, even of it isn't going to Hilary or Donald. You're equating voting for a losing candidate with a vote not counting. Truth is they count exactly the same. Neither vote is going to change this election.
No I'm equating that a negative vote toward one of the two parties will ultimately count since only the winner and loser will be in these ballots. A, lost vote of a write in will not be tabulated for a winner or loser of the two parties. It will not enhance or detract from either candidate. It will just go into the void as if you didn't vote. By voting for a third party it will be lost but will not effect a positive or negative within the two parties. If you vote for the Republican candidate in order to increase the count against the Democrat it wlll at least offset a positive vote for the them. If a vote is cast toward a third party neither the Republican or write will benefit. Nothing will be offset toward a democratic candidate. They will likely benefit because fragmenting voters doesn't hurt their position. Democrats will never lose their polorazation. They will vote for the donkey if that is who is on the ballot.
 
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