Washington Redtails? LMAO

[Cujo]

Question. Regarding the "N" word, I see and hear black people use the word often and black comedians as well. There doesn't seem to be any offense taken in that setting so is it the word that is offensive or who is saying the word?

I have discussed this with black friends before and the general consensus is, it's all about context, e.g., "What's up, nigga!" is a lot different than "You fucking nigger!"

 

[Cujo]

We should probably get them all together for a round table.

Well, maybe, smartass. That would have a lot more credibility than an anonymous letter from 'Kevin'.

 

[Cujo]

I don't think the minority of professional victims and activists who are making up crap about the term Washington Redskins being offensive speak for Native American populations either. In any case, that article wasn't to prove definitely that Kevin speaks for the majority of Native Americans (no, the poll numbers do that instead), but rather to point out the logical arguments against repealing the name Washington Redskins. Namely in his last paragraph, where it states how the Redskins mascot is not depcited in a derogatory manner but rather a respectful one. This seriously undermines the argument that Native Americans can actually be offended by this term.

Ya, I can tell (after doing a search myself) than you found a survey with results skewed in your favor before posting it and this weak shit was all you could find.

 

[Cujo]

Consider the legal concept of the hyper-sensitive plaintiff. This is a conception in the area of tort law. The term "battery" means an unwelcome or offensive touching. You can be sued for touching someone in an unwelcome or offensive manner. You can be liable for doing this.

However, giving someone a friendly pat on the back can never, as a rule of law, be a battery. Even if you come across a victim (plaintiff) who has, say, a rare bone disorder where all his bones shatter at the slightest contact. This person could be seriously injured by a friendly tap. In this specific person's unique case, a friendly pat on the back could cause untold damage and would most certainly be both unwelcome and offensive.

Now, I can't tell that injured person that he can't be hurt by the friendly tap. But the law holds that because the victim/plaintiff here is "hyper-sensitive," the offender cannot be liable.

That is the case here. The vast majority of Native Americans aren't bothered by this. There is no demonstrable harm, as has been determined by federal courts.

There is no argument. The term cannot be said to be derogatory in the mainstream even if the lunatic fringe says they are offended by it. They are the equivalent of the hyper-sensitive plaintiff, and they've already been booted out of court once for their meritless arguments.

What a shitty comparison.

 

[Cujo]

Damn right. We have made sure to keep only the white people in positions of authority. We feel it's working fairly well.

Well now your argument makes a little more sense.

 

[Smitty]

The U.S. Patent and Trademark Board obtained a similar finding about the team name of Washington's professional football team. Neither the general public nor Native Americans are of one mind on the subject.

FWIW, there are two separate points here. One is that there is no evidence of actual discrimination or disparagement that stems from the use of that word. This was the holding of a US Appeals Court in a US Patent and Trademark Case, which was later upheld in the form of the US Supreme Court electing to not take the case. I assume this is the US Patent and Trademark Board info this is referring to.

The second point is that the majority of Native Americans are not offended by the term. Note that "number or percentage of people offended" is a different standard than "whether actual harm can be demonstrated from the use of the word."

Each case is a losing argument for those seeking to say that the term Redskin should be barred from team usage.

Stapleton (2001, pp.26-27) reported that a survey conducted for the case showed that 46% of the general public (n = 301) and 37% of American Indians (n = 358) found “Redskin”to be an offensive term.

37% huh? That changes everything.

Independently, Stapleton (2001) also studied the opinions of fans (n = 28) and Native Americans (n = 32) with Web sites: although 96% of the fans opposed changing the team name, 72% of indigenous peoples favored the name change (pp. 62-64).

Ah... the Native Americans with web sites are on the side of abolishment though. That's a huge demographic.

From your same article:

In March 2001, Joseph Kolb (2001) reported the findings of a University New Mexico at Gallup poll of 458 Native Americans. The results were similar to those published in SI: 25% felt honored, 21% were not offended, 18% were partially offended, 6% were very offended, and 23% did not care

So who are the ones that have a huge problem?

Indian Country Today (ICT) (2001) published results of its survey of its American Indian Opinion Leaders, a group of self-selected Native Americans who offer feedback to the newspaper on issues of importance.In contrast with SI’s findings, respondents overwhelmingly held critical views of mascots and their implications: 81% found them to be “offensive and deeply disparaging”; 10% thought names and mascots were respectful; 73% believed they fostered a hostile environment; 75% agreed that they were a violation of antidiscrimination laws, and 69% indicated that funds should be withheld from schools with Native American mascots.

Who are these people?

a group of self-selected Native Americans who offer feedback to the newspaper on issues of importance

Ahhh. The cranks who have nothing better to do than write angry letters to local newspapers. The ones attending college? Overwhelmingly don't care.

 

[Smitty]

What a shitty comparison.

It's a great comparison. You don't have a case if you are the one being hyper-sensitive. Society doesn't have to change it's behavior to make room for your fringe demands.

 

[Smitty]

Ya, I can tell (after doing a search myself) than you found a survey with results skewed in your favor before posting it and this weak shit was all you could find.

I'm glad that you went out and found more polls that support me, then.

 

[Cujo]

It's a great comparison. You don't have a case if you are the one being hyper-sensitive. Society doesn't have to change it's behavior to make room for your fringe demands.

I'm not making any demands. I'm just saying it's fucking stupid for a white guy to tell other ethnic groups the they shouldn't be offended. But I'm not saying that we should tell them they should be offended, either. Just that it should be up to them.

 

[Cujo]

I'm glad that you went out and found more polls that support me, then.

I posted the first one I found just to show you that 9%/91% may not be factual numbers and is really just splitting hairs, ultimately. If they say they're not offended, so be it. I have no dog in this race. I am not Native American. See what I'm getting at?

 

[Cujo]

I'm glad that you went out and found more polls that support me, then.

 

[Smitty]

I'm not making any demands. I'm just saying it's fucking stupid for a white guy to tell other ethnic groups the they shouldn't be offended. But I'm not saying that we should tell them they should be offended, either. Just that it should be up to them.

And I'm saying that the term has lost all offensive connotation in today's usage by the Washington Redskins. There is no demonstrable damage, as determined by a court. The majority of Native Americans don't find it offensive. There are legal principles that say that when you act reasonably, you are not liable to some fringe person's needs. For all intents and purposes, that term has been "public domained" into non-offensiveness, both by the people using it and the vast majority of people hearing it.

So I'm saying get the fuck over it.

It's up to them whether they want to sulk about it, maybe; it should no longer be up to them to be able to force the mainstream into abandoning use of something that is now significantly part of OUR cultural heritage, ie, football.

 

[Cujo]

And I'm saying that the term has lost all offensive connotation in today's usage by the Washington Redskins. There is no demonstrable damage, as determined by a court. The majority of Native Americans don't find it offensive. There are legal principles that say that when you act reasonably, you are not liable to some fringe person's needs. For all intents and purposes, that term has been "public domained" into non-offensiveness, both by the people using it and the vast majority of people hearing it.

Looks like law school taught you well.

So I'm saying get the fuck over it.

Are you telling me to get the fuck over it? I believe I've already told you several goddamn times I'm not Native American and don't feel qualified to make an opinion one way or the other.

It's up to them whether they want to sulk about it, maybe

Ya, ok, maybe.

 

[L.T. Fan]

Mexican is a nationality. Right? Surely you see the difference.

But doesn't some back people want to identify with nationality? African American?

 

[L.T. Fan]

I have discussed this with black friends before and the general consensus is, it's all about context, e.g., "What's up, nigga!" is a lot different than "You fucking nigger!"

So you think I can now start greeting my black friends with "What's up nigga" and they will be o.k. with that? Don' think so.

 

[Cowboysrule122]

Rename them something equally offensive.

Niggers
Kikes
Chinks
Gooks
Spics
Slants
Spear Chuckers
Ect....

You forgot Honkie or Cracker.

 

[EZ22]

Question. Regarding the "N" word, I see and hear black people use the word often and black comedians as well. There doesn't seem to be any offense taken in that setting so is it the word that is offensive or who is saying the word?

The same reason you can call your wife a bitch if she's being one but if someone else calls her a bitch, you'd be pissed.

 

[EZ22]

So you think I can now start greeting my black friends with "What's up nigga" and they will be o.k. with that? Don' think so.

To be fair coming from you they would probably find it hilarious.

 

[Cowboysrule122]

 

[Smitty]

Are you telling me to get the fuck over it? I believe I've already told you several goddamn times I'm not Native American and don't feel qualified to make an opinion one way or the other.

I'm saying whoever has a problem with it should get the fuck over it.