NBA Chatter Thread

Simpleton

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These bumblefucks have the longest winning streak in NBA history (5) immediately following a double digit losing streak. They can't even tank right.

At least Dunn looks like a pretty legit piece moving forward and we should get some pretty good trade value out of Mirotic and/or Portis as far as draft picks.
 

1bigfan13

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It appears as if I gave up on the Thunder too soon. They are starting to figure it out. They've played some really good basketball the past few weeks. They've compiled something like a 12-3 record this month with some solid wins over the likes of the Rockets, Raptors, Pacers, and T-Wolves mixed in there.

The biggest difference is Westbrook has stopped trying to defer as much. He's playing like he's the best player on the team and making the new players adjust to his style. A few NBA analysts/former players like Barkley, Steve Smith, and Greg Anthony have mentioned that Russ needs to play that way. They pointed out how the Heat had the same issues when Lebron came on board in 2010. Lebron deferred too much until the team finally came to the conclusion that Lebron, being the best player of the group, needed to be the team leader that everyone else plays off of.

I'm really hoping this isn't just a one month flash. I want to see someone in the West actually push the Warriors to 6 or 7 games.
 

Simpleton

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It appears as if I gave up on the Thunder too soon. They are starting to figure it out. They've played some really good basketball the past few weeks. They've compiled something like a 12-3 record this month with some solid wins over the likes of the Rockets, Raptors, Pacers, and T-Wolves mixed in there.

The biggest difference is Westbrook has stopped trying to defer as much. He's playing like he's the best player on the team and making the new players adjust to his style. A few NBA analysts/former players like Barkley, Steve Smith, and Greg Anthony have mentioned that Russ needs to play that way. They pointed out how the Heat had the same issues when Lebron came on board in 2010. Lebron deferred too much until the team finally came to the conclusion that Lebron, being the best player of the group, needed to be the team leader that everyone else plays off of.

I'm really hoping this isn't just a one month flash. I want to see someone in the West actually push the Warriors to 6 or 7 games.
If anybody is pushing the Warriors it'll be a healthy San Antonio or Houston, OKC can soften them up a bit with a tough 2nd round series though assuming they're the 4 seed.

Westbrook/George is a really good tandem to go up against the Warriors with, and Adams is a nice physical rim-runner who can play tough interior defense, but at the end of the day Charmin Anthony will be what holds you back from beating a team like that.
 

1bigfan13

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If anybody is pushing the Warriors it'll be a healthy San Antonio or Houston, OKC can soften them up a bit with a tough 2nd round series though assuming they're the 4 seed.

Westbrook/George is a really good tandem to go up against the Warriors with, and Adams is a nice physical rim-runner who can play tough interior defense, but at the end of the day Charmin Anthony will be what holds you back from beating a team like that.
I agree in a 7 game series the Warriors probably win in 6.

But I do think OKC has better athletes on the perimeter to disrupt the Warriors offense than the Rockets. Between Westbrook, George, and Roberson OKC can switch effortlessly to keep someone in the pockets of the Warriors' shooters at all times.
 

Cotton

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Simpleton

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Good trade for the Bulls.

Mirotic had no future in Chicago once Markkanen was drafted and Portis is more or less a reasonable facsimile, not as good of a 3 point shooter but a more physical presence/better rebounder on the interior who can backup both the 4 and 5.

Now hopefully they can find a way to add another 1st one way or the other, but if they end up with let's say, the 5th and 17th picks in the draft I think you feel pretty good about that.
 

Simpleton

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Random hot take on the 18 prospects, but I've been thinking for a while now that Jaren Jackson might be the best big in the draft.

Never really loved Bagley, perhaps because I feel like he's a tough pairing with Markkanen, Ayton checks all the boxes physically and seems like he should be dominant, but there's just something missing there, and Bamba has through the roof defensive potential but he's almost useless offensively at this point.

Jackson on the other hand fits what the NBA is now perfectly, stylistically speaking. He might be just as good as Bamba defensively, albeit 1-2 inches shorter, he has an awkward but pretty consistent 3 point shot and he can put the ball on the floor some.

In 1995 Ayton would be the better fit, clearly, perhaps Bagley as well, but nowadays as a big man if you aren't a "stretch 4" type, you're a high-energy, rim-running rim protector who needs to be able to switch on PnR and is kind of an uber role player. The fact that Jackson can shoot the 3 makes the package even more impressive.

It just seems like running offense through traditional big men has a capped ceiling in today's league, even if they have some 3 point ability like Towns, Davis or Cousins. Look at Minnesota, Towns is one of the best bigs in the league but they couldn't even sniff the playoffs until they got a wing like Butler.

What I guess I'm saying is that certain skillsets in big men just aren't desirable anymore and I think those skillsets are what Bagley/Ayton's games are predicated on, while Jackson just seems like a better fit for what the league is now.
 

Smitty

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I am gonna agree that JJJ is a better fit for the Bulls than Bagley. I'll go a step further and say that I think JJJ is the better prospect than Bagley, period. Bagley has a great motor, but he lacks explosiveness, can't finish with both hands (which is a big no-no in the NBA), and for his weight -- he's rather smallish -- he seems too floor-bound. He doesn't have anywhere near as good an outside shot as Markkanen, so he will not be better than him as a stretch 4. Given his lack of real bounce, which is not terrible, but just not great, I don't know if I love projecting him to bulk up to be a 5. I don't know if he can handle it. If he loses any explosion, it would be real bad for him. I certainly do not see that he can improve his quickness to be a 3, he's too tall and gangley to have the mobility you'd need to run with LBJ or KD. I just don't see Bagley's fit as a star in the NBA. His motor may keep him from busting, but I don't see a skill set that is gonna allow him to thrive. Bagley scores in bunches but it is all just inside over smaller players, facing the basket. Not a recipe for success in the NBA.

Jackson, on the other hand, has a motor, but a more polished physique to bang around inside. I think his outside shooting is also better. He looks like a DPOY candidate some day. His offense is more raw, but I can see his path to being a good offensive player. If he's Joakim Noah with 15-18 ppg offensive potential, that is much, much more valuable than Bagley IMO.

Ayton is kind of a traditional big.... but.... man he is sick looking. I know the league goes away from that today, but Joel Embiid is a really effing good player. KAT is a really good player. DeMarcus Cousins is a really good player. I hesitate to build around two bigs, but Markkanen can be one of the best stretch 4's since Dirk, and Ayton isn't a classic anchor. He has some range. He doesn't clog the middle. He's a fricking bull (no pun intended). He's Karl Anthony Towns but with defense. I think he's in the next Anthony Davis/Joel Embiid/KAT mold. I would take this guy all day..... it's just..... can the Bulls succeed built around the Center and PF? Is that a recipe for success in today's NBA? If Markkanen was Chris Bosh or Amare Stoudamire, I'd run away from that pairing. But I think Markkanen can be so good from outside and inside, and I think Ayton can be good enough from 15 feet and from 3, that you can in fact space the floor with these two still. It helps that LaVine can really hit from outside too.

I think the question is, is Porter or Trae Young the better fit (if you even have a choice)?

I mean, if you are picking 6th, Bamba might be your only option left. Which I'd still take, but I don't know how he fits with Markkanen. He's a big who can hit occasional threes but his offense is so raw, he's a project and might never be more than a black hole on offense who is a very good defender. He's also so thin, projecting him is a big guessing game. I really hope some team falls in love with him and Bagley and they each go before the Bulls pick, if the Bulls end up at 5 or 6.
 

Simpleton

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Ayton should be a defensive anchor but he isn't really one right now, he's kind of lost on that side of the ball, which could improve over time. I agree that he could fit with Markkanen (I think Markkanen can fit with literally any style of player except for guys who are strictly 4's) but I'd honestly rather just see him go elsewhere. I think he'll be a good player and I wouldn't complain about taking him but I'd honestly rather see him go elsewhere.

Embiid, Davis, Cousins, Towns, they're all elite players but where are their teams?

Minnesota couldn't sniff the playoffs until Butler got there, Davis and Cousins could barely get there on their own and were basically a 6/7 seed together, and we'll see on Embiid, although for as much hype as he gets the Sixers are still barely holding on to the 8 seed in a shit East.

I just don't really like the idea of building an offense around big men in this day and age, especially if they aren't elite defensively, which I don't think Ayton is.

What I'm getting at is that I think Jackson could be more effective/impactful if he wasn't the center of attention offensively, whereas I don't think Ayton, and especially not Bagley could be.

As far as Bamba, if he's the BPA you take him and go with it. It's not ideal but he has DPOY potential and I think he fits with Markkanen for the same reasons that Jackson does, he's your defensive anchor/garbage man/rebounder, you just don't get the added 3 point shooting/ball handling like you do from Jackson.

As far as Young vs. Porter, I mean it's impossible to know what Porter is so it's almost impossible to answer. I'd rather just hope for Doncic to fall or take Jackson.
 

Smitty

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So what's your desired order of prospects?

I think mine is

1) Doncic
2) Ayton
3) Porter
4) Young
5) JJJ
6) Bagley
7) Bamba

And I guess depending on my mood, I'd switch Bagley and Bamba.

I like Jackson but again, I see him as like a Draymond Green or Noah with more offense. Thats a very good player, it's an all-star caliber player, multi-year. But I am currently putting Young and Porter ahead on the premise that they could be Steph Curry-lite or Kevin Durant-lite. I could be sold on either depending on a scouting report I trusted that had one over the other. The thing is, the Bulls have their potential star up front in Markkanen. They need a back court star or wing star, and I don't know if they have one -- Dunn and LaVine are nice players, but not championship caliber players. They are better as maybe 4th options.

That's why, yeah, Doncic is the best option, but he's gonna go 1 or 2. Scoring, facilitating, point-forward type, he takes pressure off Dunn but can also score like a top level wing at SF, can defend and rebound, he's the whole package, potentially.

I have to keep Ayton at 2 because while I agree I don't know if teams can be built to win with 2 big men, the Bulls are in the best position to find out since the piece they already have is Dirk-like and can stretch the floor better than most other traditional stretch 4's.... maybe better than any other stretch 4 within a year or two. If you could give me Towns with defense to pair with Markkanen, man, that is drool worthy. Yes, AD and Cousins are only a 6th seed, but that's a 6th seed out west, and their entire back court is pure garbage.
 

Simpleton

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I think I'd go:

1. Doncic
2. Ayton
3. JJJ
4. Porter
5. Bagley
6. Young
7. Bamba

It's really tough with Porter being out and Bagley not being much of a fit with Markkanen, and I'm all about BPA when it comes to the NBA draft.

As an aside, I don't think Doncic is a lock to go top 2. I think Ayton will go ahead of him just because he's such a physical specimen and has the production to back it up, and then for teams that aren't set at the 4 I think the Bagley hype could carry the day. I wouldn't even be surprised if Porter or Young went ahead of him.
 

Carp

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Young would be perfect for the Bulls....creates for others and more importantly for himself. I like what Dunn is doing and Lavine is playing well too, but to have a 3 guard rotation would be great, then you have an in house PG should Dunn leave.
 

Carp

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Holy shit...the Cavs are adding Clarkson, Nance, Hill, and Hood.
 

Carp

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As an aside...IT, even if 100% healthy, is a guy I don't want on my team. He a little bitch.
 

Smitty

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I go back and forth on Young. If he's a Steph Curry lite, I want him.

But he also seems like a potential very large bust.
 

Carp

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I go back and forth on Young. If he's a Steph Curry lite, I want him.

But he also seems like a potential very large bust.
The guy is going to be a scorer in this league...he can create shots. He has the benefit of playing for an excellent coach in Krueger and will certainly need a coach that can harness him.
 

Carp

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This Cavs team is going to be fun to watch.
 

Carp

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IT informed the Lakers he is not coming off the bench. What an entitled little shit...he was a feel good story last year, now he comes off as selfish and a crybaby.
 
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