2018 Random Cowboys Stuff Thread...

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Cowboysrock55

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You are referring to John Elway? Notice I never said "don't roll out players." Maybe you'll notice a difference between Prescott and John Elway, though.
Shanahan did it with all of his QBs. It was zone run after zone run and bootlegs and rollouts to the opposite side. Granted he had less success with the string of shitty QBs he had following Elway but he still managed to make the playoffs with them.
 

Cotton

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I said it makes no sense to critique the staff for not rolling Prescott out all the time until he masters downfield passing from the pocket.

Rolling him out a ton only generates temporary success. It will surprise the defense at first.... then they will summarily take it away, because it limits the offense to half the field when you roll out. If you spend a season rolling out Prescott a lot more than normal, it may result in success that season, but defenses will figure out that tendency and easily take it away.

If you are going to use roll outs as a part of your bag of tricks, that is fine; but it needs to be limited to being a minority playcall.

If your complaint is "Prescott is less effective in the pocket, so the answer is to move him outside the pocket," that is faulty logic. Unless what you are going for is only short term surprise effectiveness. Long term, that strategy is doomed to fail.

John Elway is a Hall of Fame QB. Teams couldn't sell out to stop bootlegs and roll outs against Elway because.... he's a Hall of Fame QB who can beat them from anywhere. Including the pocket.

Prescott isn't effective enough from the pocket yet. He has to get much better at that or he will be out of Dallas within 2 more years.

As such..... yeah.... make his ass work on his pocket passing.
See, this is why no one can have a civil discussion with you. Who said anything about rolling him out ALL THE TIMEZ!!!!?

Try having an honest discussion.
 

Smitty

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Shanahan did it with all of his QBs. It was zone run after zone run and bootlegs and rollouts to the opposite side. Granted he had less success with the string of shitty QBs he had following Elway but he still managed to make the playoffs with them.
Thanks for making my argument for me. Why would I want to emulate all of Shanahan's limited post-Elway success with shitty QBs? Wow, he made the playoffs. Great.

Prescott needs to be molded and developed into a lethal downfield pocket passer. That's what Russell Wilson has become. That's what Prescott needs to become.
 

Cowboysrock55

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I said it makes no sense to critique the staff for not rolling Prescott out all the time until he masters downfield passing from the pocket.
If you think last year looked like a team trying to teach it's QB to master downfield passing then I'm not sure why we should bother discussing this because I don't think you have any recollection of the games.
 

Smitty

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See, this is why no one can have a civil discussion with you. Who said anything about rolling him out ALL THE TIMEZ!!!!?

Try having an honest discussion.
Take your own advice, then.

I'm not saying to "never" roll him out either.

I'm saying it doesn't make sense to force the staff to roll him out a ton. We do roll him out occasionally. I don't think it needs to be artificially inflated.

Dak's long term success here will not be built around roll outs, if he is to succeed. Why would I call for it to be a staple of the offense?
 

Smitty

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If you think last year looked like a team trying to teach it's QB to master downfield passing then I'm not sure why we should bother discussing this because I don't think you have any recollection of the games.
I already ceded that the offensive playcalling last year left a lot to be desired.

However, calling more roll outs is not the answer.
 

Cowboysrock55

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I already ceded that the offensive playcalling last year left a lot to be desired.

However, calling more roll outs is not the answer.
What is the answer in your opinion? Dak needs to just be a better QB?

I'd settle for 2016 Dak coming back.
 

Smitty

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What is the answer in your opinion? Dak needs to just be a better QB?

I'd settle for 2016 Dak coming back.
There's a lot of things that need to change.

Dak has to be better himself, yes. That is one of the things.
 

Cowboysrock55

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There's a lot of things that need to change.

Dak has to be better himself, yes. That is one of the things.
I agree Dak needs to be better. But that's not all by itself going to make this offense better. There was a lot wrong last year frankly. Zeke's 4.1 yards per carry wasn't great either. But I think that was a combination of the O-line not playing up to the level of the previous year and frankly I think Zeke was distracted. Shit the whole team was distracted by the Zeke situation. Maybe not having that this offseason will be enough. Along with a super young defense continuing to take steps forward. Our entire secondary was basically newbies last year.

I think I'm now on board with Hernandez in the first. Assuming Derwin James, Roquan Smith and Edmunds are all gone. I'd probably follow it up with a really good LBer or safety in round two and an explosive WR in round three. But that's just me. Then hope to snag a TE in the fourth as well as a DT. But obviously you can't pigeon hole positions like that on draft day. It's just what would be ideal for me.
 

Cotton

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Take your own advice, then.

I'm not saying to "never" roll him out either.

I'm saying it doesn't make sense to force the staff to roll him out a ton. We do roll him out occasionally. I don't think it needs to be artificially inflated.

Dak's long term success here will not be built around roll outs, if he is to succeed. Why would I call for it to be a staple of the offense?
They don’t do it often enough. Period.
 

Cowboysrock55

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Oooh, I think that's way too much.
Are we talking 30% of passes or 30% of all plays. I think that's perfect for passes. If it's of all plays it may be too high. I mean you're throwing the ball probably 50% of the time in Dallas at most. So 30% of all plays means that over half your passing attempts are play actions and roll outs. That's probably a little too high. Especially when you consider that a number of those passes will be in obvious passing downs where the roll outs and fakes won't do much of anything. But 30% of passes I'd say absolutely. Your biggest strength is your running game. We have 3 first round all pros on the O-line and an all pro caliber top 5 draft pick at RB. You should absolutely be using that deception to your advantage.
 

Genghis Khan

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He is just so good on the run. I don't know how in the world this is not obvious to Garrett. We should be doing designed roll-outs/bootlegs all the damn time, but no, they want him to be something he is not.
See, this is why no one can have a civil discussion with you. Who said anything about rolling him out ALL THE TIMEZ!!!!?

Try having an honest discussion.

:unsure
 

Smitty

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Yeah, but I'm the one being dishonest.

Yes, I do know what Iamtdg means. He should also know what I mean. It's colloquialism, we get it.

I'm not being "dishonest" any more than he is.

I don't think designed roll outs as a staple of your offense is good. He thinks it is.

Don't know why he needs to be insulting, other than it's easy to paint Smitty as the lunatic Garrett lover.
 

Couchcoach

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Oooh, I think that's way too much.
Play action and roll outs are great, but I cringe every time Dak goes on an option. I'm afraid a LB is going to end his season. Too risky to run this play more than once or twice IMO.
 
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