New OC Kellen Moore Receiving Rave Reviews Early On

deadrise

DCC 4Life
Joined
Dec 27, 2017
Messages
934
"They don't owe Moore a thing. Garrett on the other hand, they have invested a significant amount of emotional capital into. They want him to succeed much more than they give a crap abuot Moore being stifled."

Here's the thing: do they care more about winning, or about Garrett succeeding because they have "emotional capital" invested in him? An owner/GM/front office operation shouldn't give a shit about emotional capital invested in a head coach. Winning's all that counts.
 

L.T. Fan

I'm Easy If You Are
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
21,689
"They don't owe Moore a thing. Garrett on the other hand, they have invested a significant amount of emotional capital into. They want him to succeed much more than they give a crap abuot Moore being stifled."

Here's the thing: do they care more about winning, or about Garrett succeeding because they have "emotional capital" invested in him? An owner/GM/front office operation shouldn't give a shit about emotional capital invested in a head coach. Winning's all that counts.
Your post contradicts itself. You say all they care about is winning and that is correct. That’s why they are shifting the offensive duties away from Garrett. Then you say they have emotional capital vested in Garrett even thoug his offensive systems haven’t been successful. If Moore shows significant improvement in the offense then the GM will have to say hands off Moore to Garrett. How will the emotional capital hold up if Garrett takes a position he is going to get involved with the offense again?
 

deadrise

DCC 4Life
Joined
Dec 27, 2017
Messages
934
Your post contradicts itself. You say all they care about is winning and that is correct. That’s why they are shifting the offensive duties away from Garrett. Then you say they have emotional capital vested in Garrett even thoug his offensive systems haven’t been successful. If Moore shows significant improvement in the offense then the GM will have to say hands off Moore to Garrett. How will the emotional capital hold up if Garrett takes a position he is going to get involved with the offense again?

No, that's not what my post said. I asked an either/or question: do they care more about winning, or about Garrett succeeding because they have "emotional capital" invested in him? There's ample evidence that Jerry values Garrett's role as HC not only because of the emotional capital -- Garrett is like a surrogate member of the family -- but also because Garrett is willing to absorb regular doses of humiliation from Jerry.

And during his 8 1/2-year tenure, Garrett's "offensive systems" have produced exactly three post-season appearances and two playoff wins. That kind of record has been mediocre enough to get more than a few coaches fired. It hardly qualifies as "successful."

Garrett can't control Jerry, but he can control how much influence or visibility his coaches have, especially on the offensive side of the ball. Garrett wins just enough to keep Jerry from becoming "irrelevant," which Jerry dreads more than anything, and does so at a comfort level that lets Jerry relax.

If Jerry were to fire Garrett after all this time, it would immediately raise question of "what took so long?" And though Jerry says and does profoundly stupid things all the time, firing Garrett at this late stage would finally expose his incompetence for what it truly is -- the underlying cause of 25 years worth of futility. Jerry fears looking stupid almost as much as he fears becoming irrelevant.
 

Smitty

DCC 4Life
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
22,488
Your post contradicts itself. You say all they care about is winning and that is correct. That’s why they are shifting the offensive duties away from Garrett. Then you say they have emotional capital vested in Garrett even thoug his offensive systems haven’t been successful. If Moore shows significant improvement in the offense then the GM will have to say hands off Moore to Garrett. How will the emotional capital hold up if Garrett takes a position he is going to get involved with the offense again?
The narrative has been written, dude. Don’t question it.
 

Chocolate Lab

Mere Commoner
Joined
Oct 2, 2014
Messages
19,859
Your post contradicts itself. You say all they care about is winning and that is correct.
"All they care about is winning" is most certainly not correct.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying.
 

Cotton

One-armed Knife Sharpener
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
119,732
"All they care about is winning" is most certainly not correct.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying.
You aren't misunderstanding him. He and I have had this same discussion and he is most certainly not correct. If all Jerry cared about was winning he would hire the coaches/GM to facilitate that winning and he is not willing to make that jump.
 

Simpleton

DCC 4Life
Joined
Apr 8, 2013
Messages
17,418
The offense should be better on it's face just due to internal improvement from Gallup improving from his 1st to 2nd year, to Amari and Dak actually having an offseason to enhance their chemistry, and the return of Frederick. The only way I'm giving Moore significant credit is if the offense improves dramatically, which should honestly be expected given the amount of talent Moore has to work with if you believe that he truly is a special football mind.
 

L.T. Fan

I'm Easy If You Are
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
21,689
You aren't misunderstanding him. He and I have had this same discussion and he is most certainly not correct. If all Jerry cared about was winning he would hire the coaches/GM to facilitate that winning and he is not willing to make that jump.
You are saying what you would do if you made the decisions for the franchise. Jones actually thinks he is doing the right things and no one can convince him otherwise. He cares about winning he just isn’t going to give up his position with the team and that’s the only position he will take. His methodology however isn’t consistent with a lot of others who would do things differently. You just aren’t seeing his thought process nor does a lot of us see his point of view but he actually believes he does the right things for the franchise. Your position in changing the trends is simply different from his.
 
Last edited:

Cotton

One-armed Knife Sharpener
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
119,732
You are saying what you would do if you made the decisions for the franchise. Jones actually thinks he is doing the right things and no one can convince him otherwise. He cares about winning he just isn’t going to give up his position with the team and that’s the only position he will take. His methodology however isn’t consistent with a lot of others who would do things differently. You just aren’t seeing his thought process nor does a lot of us see his point of view but he actually believes he does the right things for the franchise. Your position in changing the trends is simply different from his.
Then he is an idiot, because only an idiot will bang their heads against the wall for 20+ years hoping for different results without changing parts of the equation in an attempt to get those wanted results.
 

L.T. Fan

I'm Easy If You Are
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
21,689
Then he is an idiot, because only an idiot will bang their heads against the wall for 20+ years hoping for different results without changing parts of the equation in an attempt to get those wanted results.
I think most will agree he is one of the large problems with the organization. He isn’t going to change nor is he going to give up control of the franchise. He just cannot or will not concede that his management over the last several years is the problem while at the same time he thinks he is doing what it takes to be a winner. It’s a no win situation from an individual that thinks he is doing what it takes.
 

Chocolate Lab

Mere Commoner
Joined
Oct 2, 2014
Messages
19,859
You are saying what you would do if you made the decisions for the franchise. Jones actually thinks he is doing the right things and no one can convince him otherwise.
The Parcells hire is all the evidence you need to show otherwise. If it weren't for the Jerryworld funding coming up, he never would have hired Parcells and given him power.

Once the vote for Jerry's Monument to Himself passed, he went right back to his old ways.
 

L.T. Fan

I'm Easy If You Are
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
21,689
The Parcells hire is all the evidence you need to show otherwise. If it weren't for the Jerryworld funding coming up, he never would have hired Parcells and given him power.

Once the vote for Jerry's Monument to Himself passed, he went right back to his old ways.
I think the Parcells tenure only solidified the idea for Jones that if he turns over control to a top football mind they did no better than what the team was doing under his control. Parcells really didn’t accomplish a great deal while he was here.
 

jsmith6919

Honored Member - RIP
Joined
Aug 26, 2013
Messages
28,407
I think the Parcells tenure only solidified the idea for Jones that if he turns over control to a top football mind they did no better than what the team was doing under his control. Parcells really didn’t accomplish a great deal while he was here.
 

Cotton

One-armed Knife Sharpener
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
119,732
I think the Parcells tenure only solidified the idea for Jones that if he turns over control to a top football mind they did no better than what the team was doing under his control. Parcells really didn’t accomplish a great deal while he was here.
Come on, man.
 

1bigfan13

Your favorite player's favorite player
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
27,123
I think the Parcells tenure only solidified the idea for Jones that if he turns over control to a top football mind they did no better than what the team was doing under his control. Parcells really didn’t accomplish a great deal while he was here.


Parcells literally turned the franchise around overnight. They immediately went from three consecutive seasons of 5-11 records and being one of the laughingstocks of the NFL to a respectable, perennial playoff contender under Parcells guidance.

If not for Parcells, Jerry would still be farting around with buffoons like Dave Campo. And you can forget about ever having Romo and Witten in the fold. Gems like those guys were found by Parcells and his staff.

Drew Henson, Chad Hutchinson, Quincy Carter, and Clint Stoerner....that's what Jerry brought to the table pre-Parcells. So please don't say Parcells didn't accomplish much while here in Dallas. He may not have won a title but given what he inherited, I'd say he accomplished a ton. He essentially turned water into wine.
 

Cowboysrock55

Super Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
52,465
34/30 record with no playoff wins. How is that a turn around?
We were 5-11 like 3 years in a row before he got there. 3 of his four years here were winning seasons and 2 out of 4 were playoff births. He totally remade the roster in the process. You really can't see how the roster was remade for success over those 4 years? I mean seriously? This team was gutter trash before that. The team Parcells built lasted for a long time. Shit guys like Witten are still here from that legacy.
 

1bigfan13

Your favorite player's favorite player
Staff member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
27,123
34/30 record with no playoff wins. How is that a turn around?
It's a turnaround because they literally went 15-33 the three years prior to his arrival. C'mon, LT. You're better than this.

This ain't the hill to die on. :lol
 

L.T. Fan

I'm Easy If You Are
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
21,689
It's a turnaround because they literally went 15-33 the three years prior to his arrival. C'mon, LT. You're better than this.

This ain't the hill to die on. :lol
Hell. Garrett is doing better than Parcell if wins and losses are the criteria and after all what are we talking about here.style points or results? Parcells has a legacy in the NFL but his tenure at Dallas was average at best. As to drafting and building a roster the last 5 years have been better than any of Parcells years with Dallas. Other than a huge reputation, Parcells did nothing here to polish his image. He was on his way to the rocking chair and made a rest stop in Dallas. Results are results and his improvement to the franchise was slightly over 50 percent. Some improvement yes but in reality nothing speculative other than the press conferences.
 
Top Bottom